What If The Future Property Manager Stops Typing Leases

We sit down with Tania to trace her 30-year path through real estate, a surprising detour into catering, and the service mindset that makes people remember your name years later. We also get practical about offshore virtual assistants, AI-era communication, and how property managers can reclaim time to do the high-trust work that actually grows portfolios. 

• Tania’s career journey from receptionist to senior property management 
• Leaving the industry for family, returning with clearer strengths and boundaries 
• Building a catering business and the transferable skills of planning, pressure and client service 
• “Delivering an experience” as the real differentiator in property management 
• Listening more, slowing down, using a filter and respecting what matters to the client 
• Offshore virtual assistants as capacity builders rather than replacements 
• Cybersecurity and process benefits of office-based offshore teams 
• Delegation, trust and the 90% done versus perfection mindset 
• Why leasing may become a higher-value senior role as automation grows 
• AI, tribunals and handling long emotional emails with short factual replies 

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This podcast is kindly sponsored by The Associates Co. 

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Transcript

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Meet Tanya And Her Start

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Welcome to this week's episode for PM Collective. And I have got a new friend on the record today. I found her on LinkedIn, and I'm very excited to have a conversation with this lady. Her name is Tanya, and she is from UPS. Welcome, Tanya. Thank you. Now you are a good talker, so we will be absolutely fine getting through this one. I was just saying before I press record that I normally don't let people talk too much because you're going to have to repeat yourself. But you've given me a bit of a rundown, and I am really excited to hear from you because you are someone who has been in the property management space for a long time and now sort of helping the property management businesses. But I can just tell already that you have a genuine love and energy for the industry, which is really great and can't wait for you to share your stories. So let's start with getting into property management and just a little bit of your backgrounds and your history for everybody.

SPEAKER_01 0:59

Okay. So when I left school, I guess didn't know what I wanted to do. And my first job was, I guess I've been in real estate nearly all my life. My first job was as a receptionist in a real estate agency as a young 18, 19-year-old. And I'm always one who wants to learn, you know, a lot more. And back in the day, you know, if if someone was away or the it wasn't so strict in regards to, I guess, with legislation, ask if the property manager or if someone else is away. Okay, here's some keys, go and show a property. Okay. And you could get away with it. So then from there, I moved on to being a property officer and then and then property management for some quite large companies as well. So where are you based? I'm based in Sydney.

SPEAKER_03 2:01

Okay. So property officer, would that be like inspections and outside work?

SPEAKER_01 2:06

Yes, yes. So a property officer, you would assist in routine inspections, assisting the property manager. You could show show a property, but you wouldn't have the responsibility, so to speak, in regards to building that relationship with the landlord, more perhaps assisting the tenant.

SPEAKER_03 2:28

Yeah. And did you, can you just remind me, did you leave the industry then come back at any stage?

SPEAKER_01 2:35

I did, I did. So so going back, I I so I started about 30 years ago. And 15 years ago, I I left to have my first child. She she's now 15. And then I returned. I was working for an amazing boutique real estate agency. I'm still quite close with the principal, Breakfast Point Realty. And she allowed me to go back to work uh three days a week, but in property management, it's quite it's quite like a full full-on job. So I went back three days a week in sales, and then in 2012, I had my second child, and and then I was a BDM and and a bit of C CRM work. And then in 2015, I did something totally left field, and I decided to start a catering business.

SPEAKER_03 3:39

Did you have any experience of catering or cooking or anything like that before?

SPEAKER_01 3:45

Not at all. My background is Italian, I do love fine dining. I I and I and I love I know what good food tastes like. I was basically selling timber boards. And my husband at the time was was assisting in making these timber boards. And one day this woman said to me, How much is a board? And I gave her the prize, and she said to me, No, I would like it with food. And the next thing that came out of my mouth was, yeah, fine. And then two weeks after that, and and a friend heard of it because I was posting some photos on just on my on my personal page. And a friend said, Oh, I have a colleague who whose daughter is having a party for about 150 guests. She would like 25 half meter boards with food, and she would like a huge grazing table to be set up. So within four days, I made all these boards. And while I was waiting for the for the uh party to finish, and I'm I'm just sitting there on my lounge thinking, what am I going to do? I started, I created a business name. I thought I better cross my T's and dot my I's. So I registered the business, I went and I went and got all my insurances, well, named the business, set up a page, and then I went and got my certificate in uh in uh food handling and and supervising. So so I was legit. And then it was just a part-time thing. It basically, and through COVID was my one of my strongest probably times. I left the industry and then I was a full-time caterer for six years. There you go. So in total, I in total I was running the business for 10 years.

SPEAKER_00 5:50

And so what made you stop doing that? So I'm now a single mum.

SPEAKER_01 6:01

Yes. And after COVID, people decided that they wanted to or they could go back to restaurants. And with food prices and inflation, my prices were probably on par, maybe, maybe with some restaurants. And as being a sole income earner, I couldn't, I couldn't just wait around to see what catering jobs were were going to come my way. But I am blessed, I am blessed to be able to be able to cater during that time, that I was also able to be a full-time mum for my kids during the week, to be a parent helper, to to watch all their awards and to do all of that and cater on the weekend. And then I thought, well, you know, I don't know anything else. And property management, it's a hard gig. You either have it or you don't. And I believe I'm a pretty good property manager in regards to building relationships with people. So I thought, because I've had experience in all areas of real estate, do I go back to sales? I've not been in the industry for six years and being on a lower, lower base and and relying on those comms. Or do I go back to doing like what I know best? Yeah. So I had to, I,

Leaving Real Estate For Catering

SPEAKER_01 7:40

I, I let my license expire, didn't do my CPD points, so I had to do it all over again.

SPEAKER_03 7:47

Oh, but yeah what? I mean, what a great experience. And I think it's just an example of there's you know different seasons of life, and that served that season of your life. And I think that that's probably why maybe you have the energy that you do now for the industry, because you have, you know, you have explored other things. Like now it's sort of like this is perfect for where I need to be right now. Like you, you sort of maybe some people that have been in the industry for a long time probably take things for granted, or yeah, they uh they just they haven't seen the other side of it. So I just I think that's really cool. And it it sort of it's great because I think there's a lot of property managers out there that naturally have a creative flair. Um, and so yeah, I mean, people can explore it in lots of different ways. It could be uh you went full out into a business, but you know, people could explore little weekend hobbies or weekend jobs and things like that. They just allow you to continue to enjoy your career, like instead of just I don't know, just being, you know, waking up and doing a nine to five. Like there's other ways that you can seek enjoyment. And people that don't have enjoyment from other areas of their life, it's something that it will drain them. Property management. It's really healthy for property managers to have hobbies and to have things that they do, whether it's like on the weekend or after hours, because what happens is you have a really shitty day, and then if you don't have anything to look forward to, it does make it really, really difficult to like do groundhog day. You know what I mean? And actually, that's what I think we're just saying was about the the kids and teenagers. And I just feel like it's such an interesting space. And I don't know your experience with your kids, but for me, I just don't think that we're going to have children or the next generation are not going to be doing nine till five, Monday to Friday. They're going to want to be doing different things. They might be wanting to have that catering business on Friday, Saturdays, and then maybe they want to be in property management for two or three days. I just like what's your thoughts with what you see, just because you've got the teenage children as well. What do you feel like the next generation of property management with staff is going to look like? Do you have any ideas?

SPEAKER_01 10:47

You know, uh, look, I really don't know because there are more uh resources available to teenagers and also with AI, what and this is a discussion that I'm currently having with my 15-year-old that she has had to choose her year 11 and 12 electives. And I've said to her, I mean, I I've lived and and breathed property management, and if I didn't start my own business, what opportunities would I have had to work within another profession? So, I mean, like she's got a job now part-time, uh like like at um at Kmart. And um, and now that my life is kind of you know panned out somewhat, somewhat, I am reintroducing the catering as just a weekend thing, but I'm doing like the 80-20 rule. But because my daughters, they live like homeschooling, I was cooking, and while whilst whilst people were reorganizing their pantries and deciding what Netflix series to watch, because I was a an essential worker, I was cooking every day. And my and my kids helped me as like like eight, eight and nine-year-olds. So like now, because I I do bring great food to the table, I'll give myself a plug. It's called Pane Antipastid. And I do have a lot of return clients, and again, it is my creative side. Plus, I'm a people person and I love meeting people. My children who are now young teens and who are draining my pockets, they they are going to be, they are my new staff members because they've seen it and they've lived and breathed it. But um, my eldest wants to become an architect, and and you know, she's doing design and tech and what she wants to decide, you know, in uni. But I said to her, hey, if you don't like it, just explore other avenues. Do not do not feel restrained to just doing one thing. You can, you know, and and the more the more avenues you go down, the more experience you have, but life experience. And so what I wanted to discuss with you is not only with the catering did I improve my culinary skills, but it gave me a chance to express my creative side, but it challenged me in ways that I hadn't expected

Side Projects And Career Seasons

SPEAKER_01 13:55

to be able to be in the position that I currently am in now, which we can discuss like a bit later. So it wasn't just about preparing food, it was about planning my events because I ended up, you know, catering from 20 to 300 people, managing people, solving problems under pressure, communicating with clients still, you know, so providing that service that I was able to bring from property management and problem solving, because property management is not just about managing properties, it's about managing people, it's about managing landlords, it's about managing tenants, it's about managing your tradespeople, it's about building relationships. And uh, you know, you had need to be a chameleon on the outside world because uh I I was working in you know in high-end areas where you know you're dealing with landlords who are who own $10 million houses, and and and so you need to, you know, ramp up your professionalism, which should be there all the time, and then you're dealing with tenants and you're dealing with your trading and your lingo changes. So it's just deliver delivering that experience to be remembered by people, and this is why I catered a job on Saturday. I did the it was a baby shower, and I did the grandmother's 50th in 2001, and next month I'm catering a 50th and a 21st, and I was speaking to my client the other day, and she said, Yay, I was one of your first customers, and the 21-year-old, I catered his confirmation, so as a 12-year-old, but they remembered me, and in property management, I have landlords that remember me, and I'm also now living, so I I live close to Breakfast Point. So now when I'm walking, if anybody knows Sydney, if I'm walking up Majors Bay Road, Sydney, I bumped into one of my first tenants from there the other day, and he's like, Oh my god, Tanya remembered my name. I remembered his name. And I'm talking about 2005, 2006, right? And that's what makes it, that's what makes it special.

SPEAKER_03 16:49

I I like that you said delivering an experience. I think we're going to name the pod this podcast episode delivering an experience, and we'll we'll go down that road. What do you think? And and you're very welcome, and hopefully you you don't find this too uncomfortable, but you know, putting like patting yourself on the back, what do you think it's is different with with you from a you know, with how you delivered service to to both catering and property management? And what do you think people are maybe getting wrong with delivering the experience? Like, where are you seeing sort of like what do you think you do well? And what are the pain, the pain points that you're seeing other people experiencing why they just haven't been able to nail it?

SPEAKER_00 17:29

Even though I talk a lot, somebody told me this

Service That People Remember

SPEAKER_00 17:34

phrase, and I try and remember it. We were given two ears and one mouth to use them accordingly. I try and count to ten to allow the other person to listen.

SPEAKER_01 17:57

I have ADHD and if I was only really diagnosed it in later in life, I probably think most property managers do, and and I and I see it as a gift more than anything else. It helped me by catering multitask, and and I felt it was therapy, and with property management, I was able to multitask, but you need to connect with people, you need to connect with people and listen, and you need them to trust you, and in life, and the older you get, people don't want to see gray areas, it's either black or it's white, and the thing is as well, especially with AI, don't lie and don't tell a person wrong information because they're gonna go to chat, they're gonna go to Claude, right? And they're gonna prove you wrong. So you are the professional, and you need to let that client put that trust in you as being the professional. Running my own business gave me a completely different perspective. Looking back, I probably underestimated how much property management had prepared me for catering and what I'm doing now, managing people. So in my present job, I'm managing people, I'm communicating with clients, I'm solving problems under pressure. But I thrive on that. Some people won't. I'm juggling priorities. Right? So, yeah, and I and I'm using and I'm finding that I'm using those skills every single day.

SPEAKER_03 20:05

And the interesting thing with priorities, I always say is you've got to understand as well that something that might not be a priority to me, but is a priority to that person, we need to value that because when we can understand that something is really important to the other person, and we can action it and deal with it, even if in the back of my head I go to myself, I really don't have time for this. You know, that is not something that I articulate or show because it's really important to that person. And I think children teach you that. I think my it was my daughter's pretty good with her words, and she I remember must be an older, older daughter thing. But I do remember back in a long time ago, she would have only been seven at the time, and she was complaining about something. And I said, Mill, just don't stress about it. It's not a big drama. And she said, Mom, it's really, really important to me. And when you say that, I feel like you don't care for it. And I was like, Oh my gosh, of course I care for it. It's just not a big drama. But me, even just saying that, or for a property manager, even saying to a client, it's not a big drama or whatever, it is a big drama to that person. Might not be to you, but it is. And we have to acknowledge that, we have to care and nurture for that. And it's I, you know, just because yeah, we we we can all think things, but you don't have to say it. You can just hold it in your mind. Sometimes you need to have a filter. And and sometimes I say, like, we we get paid really well to be polite to people, we get paid really well to you know to to deal with you know annoying stuff sometimes, but you at no point should ever let the other person know that as well. It's an art. Yeah, I agree. Now tell me a little bit more about your position where you are now and and what what work are you doing?

SPEAKER_01 22:03

So when I got back into real estate, I was

Listening Filters And Real Priorities

SPEAKER_01 22:09

working for an agency where, and I guess with a lot of real estate, the focus was for the property manager to build those relationships with the with the clients. And let's face it, most property managers or most agents are type A personalities. Type A personalities are not the greatest at admin and paperwork. Right. So, anyhow, so we were utilizing and see, like, times had changed. I'd been out of the industry for so long. So, different software programs, they weren't cloud-based, you know, prior to me leaving the industry. So, I've come back, but I but I picked up and and I pretty much know how to use like every software program. So, we will were using the services of a virtual assistant. And so virtual assistants are real people, they are not AIs. It's not about replacing the property manager, but it's about it's about giving them giving the property manager the capacity to be an amazing property manager for their landlord. So because the property manager is juggling inspections, emails, maintenance, owner calls, arrears, tenant emails. And then someone once said to me, because any property manager watching or listening to this, you can get up to 150 emails a day, right? So there's two words proactive and reactive. So you can be a proactive property manager and and get all your lease renewals up to date, your rent increases, your routine inspections, uh, and what have you. But once if you're not attending to your emails, which is reactive, so you either sit there and respond to every single single email, but anyway, that's when you start drowning. So offshore the offshore support is an amazing opportunity to to give all of that admin work to people that you can trust. I wasn't sure what to expect. And and the opportunity came my way where I had heard of this amazing company that I'm working for now. So I'm working for a company now called Universal Property Systems. There are a lot of these companies around at the moment, and I had the experience to work with an offshore company who utilizes virtual assistants who work remotely from home. And I also had the experience to work with a company who use virtual assistants who work from an office, and I could see the difference between the two. And this is why the company that I'm working for, I believe, and I manage a team of virtual assistants offshore in the Philippines because they all work remotely from an office. They work under a team leader, they have systems to follow, follow-ups they can place. And cyber security, you know, there's there's less how can I say there is less harm like for cybersecurity and and or as well if there's virtual assistants working from home, moonlighting for somebody else. And with all this legislation, AML, and and all of this other, all this other strict legislation that's coming on board, it's it's quite stringent with with who I'm working for. So yeah, so in a nutshell, universal property systems, who I'm working for, I I manage a team of virtual assistants, and I and I'm the the middle person that I'm able to look after, manage the agencies who the my clients Australia-wide, and also with my management skills, I'm able to overlook the virtual assistants in the Philippines. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 26:50

So what do you find people's hesitations are when employing offshore?

Universal Property Systems And VAs

SPEAKER_03 26:59

Is there a common trend with what people are saying?

SPEAKER_01 27:04

I guess I guess people they become a little bit territorial. Do we trust if the if if if the property managers have an amazing relationships relationship with their clients, will they drop the ball by not by not being able to offer that service? But our virtual assistants they receive a lot of training. What the clients need to also understand is that that person is part of their team. So like anything, if there is communication between the client and between the virtual assistant by having Teams meetings with the right delivery, the right clarity and and and information, then there's no room for error. But if someone says, right, we want this person and automatically expect them to be the property manager, it's not going to work.

SPEAKER_03 28:21

Are you seeing like business owners wanting to embrace it and property managers hesitant or the other way around? Property managers want to, and more hesitation from a business owner. Anything there that you're seeing? And just a personal question, because I find it quite fascinating.

SPEAKER_01 28:39

Um yes, and and and with my experience, so so one of the agencies that I was working with, I embraced working with my with my VA because I communicated with her on a daily basis. I would WhatsApp her, send her little snippets, and so we built a relationship. And as the agency that I worked with grew, some of the property managers, so so the directors were all for it, but the property managers, they they wanted to to hold tightly onto their portfolio. And and and it was that it was that trust. So in answer to your question, it's the property managers who I think find it hard to let go. Look, because at the end of the day, if the landlord's not happy, they're gonna go to the property manager.

SPEAKER_03 29:38

Yeah, it's um oh there's so much to unpack with that because, and I guess if someone is listening to this and they are a property manager and you are feeling a little bit hesitant with potentially offshore or just changes in general in the office, prop check, whatever it might be. And you have a business owner who really wants to enable the you know, the change and staying relevant, like don't ever take that for granted because there are so many people in a different in the reverse where they want the where the property manager wants these things to, you know, to move forward and the business owner doesn't. So if you have a business owner that wants to make changes and you're the one, you know, roadblocking it, I want you to have a really good reflection at yourself because you you're you're like your life can be just so much easier. Like I nothing guts me more than seeing really good, experienced property managers and business owners that have been in the industry for a long time and are just still grinding their workload out every single day. And it's like life and work and business shouldn't be that hard. Like you've been in it long enough, you should be really reaping the benefits that business ownership or your senior property management role can bring, and people aren't taking advantage of that enough.

SPEAKER_01 31:11

Well, that's it. You know, it's like learn, learn to let go. Learn to let go. And that used to be a problem with me. Learn to delegate, learn to let go. A senior property manager of of of like 25, 30 years, I don't want to be typing leases. I have more experience than that. I want to be able to service my client. I want to pick up the phone and for my client not to say, oh my god, what's happened? Is there a burst pipe? No, I'm just ringing to say hi. We haven't had a chat in a while. You know, we've had I've been speaking with you for so long. Do you actually have other properties? I do actually. I've got three. How about we put them together? Bang. Yeah, create a task for your, you know, you the property manager has done the groundwork, right? Create a task for your VA, bang. They will prepare the MAs, they will put together everything. Once received, they will enter it into the system. But one thing to property managers, even though these MAs are being prepared, and like anyone here, onshore as well as offshore, check the work. They're not doing the work for you in regards to, I mean, like you would like 100% accuracy, but the three MAs that they've been putting into the system, you could have made another five phone calls and picked up another three, three more managements. That's what I'm saying. And it only takes two seconds to check a document.

SPEAKER_03 33:00

Yeah, and and I agree. I think we sometimes expect for perfection, perfectionism as well in documents. But if you had someone draft, I mean, this is just my opinion, maybe you might be different, but if you had someone draft up 10 MAs and then, but you've got you know, obviously you've got to go check them. And let's say there was something that you did need to tidy up on it, you know, just something little. Yeah. Well, wouldn't you rather 90% of the job be done for you? And then you just literally have to do the 10%, which might be either tweaking or like a quick little adjustment on something. Like, isn't that still better than someone just going, oh my gosh, they make so many mistakes? That's right, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 33:40

There's a different way of looking at it. Exactly, exactly. And the thing is, with most, not all, but with most software programs and you know, most platforms, they allow plugins from other other software programs. So there should not be like room for error. So if you know, if a lease agreement or sorry, if a new tenancy or a new

Trust Delegation And Checking Work

SPEAKER_01 34:09

landlord is entered into that into that platform, and then and then once the lease has to be typed, they all speak with each other, and then the ingoing inspection report and everything is migrated, there will there should not be any room for error in regards to dates, lease terms, names, because everything marries up. So it just has to do with that one initial data entry point. Yeah. And the delegation from the property manager.

SPEAKER_03 34:43

Yeah, exactly. And I I feel like everyone should take a bit of responsibility on what the future is going to hold for their careers as well. And as automation increases and you know, global teams increase and all of that, we really need to have more conversations about how the property manager role is going to evolve because we do have property managers that are very admin-based. And, you know, we went through a season where it's like a senior property manager went down the road of managing a high number of properties, but they stayed in the office and they do it from you know home, or they now don't go out to all the properties. They've got, you know, people doing the inspections and stuff, which might, for some people, that might sound like, you know, you've got to the, you know, the top of the leaderboard to get to that position that that's what you get to do. But in fact, I actually think that as the future goes on, there is going to be more value for that in-person stuff because offshore in automation is going to take over your emails in your admin. Your role is not going to be needed in that space anymore. And then you are going to have like the leasing role. I mean, I think the leasing role is so important at the moment. Yes. We put juniors in that position because that's what we've always done. But I actually would say to you that there is value putting a senior property manager in the role of the leasing because they're looking at the property and getting a good idea of the property. They're responsible for the marketing, but they're responsible for putting the right person into that property, which we know if you get the right person in the property, literally, that is an easy tenancy for the next three or four years. You put the wrong person in there, you're going to have lots of things that come up. So if we sort of go really back to basics, I'm going to predict that there's going to be more value on the leasing role because I think that's one of the most important roles at the moment.

SPEAKER_01 36:49

Well, most people who are in leasing roles sometimes skip property management and go straight into sales. Yeah. And also, I'm Gen X. I I was working with an agency uh recently where I was sitting next to either a Gen Z or a Millennial. He's he only ever had maybe like two or three in his inbox. Because, as he said, he would probably sit very efficient, sit there all day and and reply to emails, do his work, but not once, pick up the phone. But he had to listen to me all day because I'm the type of person where I want answers straight away. And rather than send, I'd always send that email anyhow for paper trail. But if I wanted to know, I I would pick up the phone. And and unfortunately, a lot of these new generations find it very hard to pick up the phone and talk to someone because they're so used to being keyboard warriors, and maybe they need to get out on the road and speak with people.

SPEAKER_03 38:05

Yeah, or I mean, and they do, but all like imagine a world where those people, like I mean, this is this is for those that are listening, this is like completely like way off. Like, I'm just like literally speaking what's on my brain right now. Or imagine a world and an industry where those people that don't like speaking to anyone don't like all of that, and do just, you know, the you know, maybe a younger generation that do just want to send the computer. Imagine an industry where that was the beginner property management role, and there was automation, and you literally just had to babysit the automation and where and that's like a basic, basic salary. And then imagine the senior role being a high you know salary and actually leasing the property, marketing, being in touch with that client. Because obviously there's loads of communication with owners when during the leasing period. That's right. Imagine, imagine if that role was worth 150,000 and the actual admin emails property manager role was actually worth the 65,000. Like imagine that being case.

SPEAKER_01 39:15

Well, look, look, it might be, it might be. And you know, AI, I just attended an REB summit in Sydney, and I really took a lot away with me, but AI can have its advantages and disadvantages as like with any

Leasing Value And Generational Shifts

SPEAKER_01 39:34

with in any industry. So I felt the last property manager job that I had, and any property managers who are listening, I'm sure will agree, there has been an influx with with tribunal, with NCAT, with um whatever state you're in, tribunal hearings, because all of a sudden, everybody knows the Tancy Act. Everybody is is is extracting, you know, all these different clauses that they're wanting to claim for this and claim for that. And and you're attending tribunal hearings with you know with with document after document after document, and it's irrelevant like to what they're claiming. But you know, like even myself, something was wrong with my car, and I put it into chat, and he's me trying to tell my mechanic, and I'm not a mechanic, that I knew exactly what was going on, you know, I knew exactly what was, you know, and the thing is all of a sudden I'm an experienced mechanic and I know all about cars, and I think this is consuming a lot of property managers' time. Yeah. And and you know, and and the thing is, and so and so but in it. The thing is, when you're receiving, you know, a 500-word document from a tenant, just reply with the facts or or invite them to come into the office. Nine times out of ten, they won't. Someone would send me a three-page document, then get a three-line answer.

SPEAKER_03 41:24

Oh my god, I'm so glad you mentioned that, Tanya, because I always say that the longer the email, the shorter my response. Yep, that's it. That's it. Yeah, that is definitely something that people need to do more. And quite often I look at those long emails and there's there's items that don't actually even need responding to.

SPEAKER_01 41:45

That's what I mean. I I'm like, did you have a glass of red? You know, or even if I go to write a long email, I'll put it in my drafts and I'll reread it in the morning. It's just it's just like online shopping, it's in that shopping basket. Yeah. When you can't sleep. Yeah. And in the morning, you'll decide whether you want to buy it or not. And generally you just cancel the the cart wide gym anyway.

SPEAKER_03 42:10

Forget it. It's um, I mean, this is another whole episode, but I'm just writing a presentation for the Remax team. I'm speaking there in a few weeks, and it comes down to that communication and getting to know the clients and how to deal with it, but also how to make sure that you've got those appropriate responses. So Chat GPT always responds with a shorter email than what they've sent you. But it's really important to tap into the reason why people react the way that they do. And you have to really be obsessed about human behavior in this role and really go into why they're being triggered, why they're being, you know, micromanaging you, why are they being aggressive? Because there is a reason behind everyone's story, and we don't give it enough time to actually understand why they're feeling that way. And a story that I share, and hopefully no one from Remax is listening to, otherwise you're gonna have to hear it again. But it's was on a lace curtain. And a number of years ago, we had a house burned down and some lace curtains that were set on fire. And as a property manager, sounds mean saying it out loud, but as a property manager, I was like, you beauty, this house needed a reno, it's gonna get a reno for insurance, you know. Yeah, yeah, no one was hurt. And so I thought I was only seeing all the positives of the situation, and the owner was not happy, and it escalated and escalated because I didn't go deeper. I was just like, What the hell are they being a pain in the ass? Like they're interested in getting new curtains, like I I couldn't understand why. And this went on and on and on, and I kept on meeting their energy with regards to it until one day I picked up the phone and I said, I, because it escalated so much. And I said, I am missing something and I don't know what it is, but I just I'm I'm not understanding why you're gonna get so angry. And it was because their mum, she had put those curtains in 40 years ago and she had recently died.

SPEAKER_02 44:17

Right.

SPEAKER_03 44:17

And I was like, I did not see that coming, and that now makes complete sense. I completely did the wrong thing by not picking up the phone earlier, by not seeing those cues, by not diving deeper, and by matching the energy that they were giving me. And and you know, it could have it didn't have to be as hard as what it it was. And so yeah, I

SPEAKER_01 44:40

feel that that that layer of communication and getting to know people is where the value is and that's where offshore and automation can help you be that relevant property manager that our future is going to need like you are going to be so sought after but if you don't do that you're really going to struggle to you know be able to get a good role get the best salary for your area you know all of those things be sought after you I mean doesn't everyone want to be in that position where they're poachable you know because

AI Emails Tribunals And Empathy

SPEAKER_01 45:20

and I and I feel yeah that's that's the that is the key word approachable yeah I'm now in a position where I am the middle person between my clients i.e real estate agents and and virtual assistants and I say to both sides I'm very approachable and I would rather be transparent and and I can assist with with anything that you want and it's about as I said like building relationships I have an owner who I worked for you know about four five years ago and he lives about six hours away and we've built this relationship that he's still ringing me for advice he's still asking me see like for like for holiday properties that that that he's got tanya can you help me do this you know can you help me I need some blinds even that and you know just because I've built that relationship for him and I know he's so far away you know like I'm his eyes and ears and I'm I'm like hey you know what it's fine I'll do it you want me to get a trade for you I'll organize it for you it's fine it's no skin off my back I don't sweat the small stuff and I think and I think that's the thing as well and it's not just the young generation it's personality based if you're going to go into a role and you say this is not my job description because that's been going around for a long time you know and when I started as a receptionist I was working for a company and I knew the sound of two of my bosses' cars right and as soon as I would hear their cars pull in their their cups and teas and coffees would be on the would would be on their desk.

SPEAKER_03 47:27

Wow right I would take away I you know wash I'd go into the kitchen you know I'd I I'd wash the cups because I did it you know but these days God God God help us if there is a you know if there's an extra cup in the sink that's not mine stack the dishwasher you know or what have you that's not my job description yeah and you're not gonna get buying life like that it it's funny isn't it like I a lot of us in in this generation we just seek to please like we are people pleasers like you know we want to I don't know if it's a good thing you know you no you can't be in then the people then the people pleasers then you need to set boundaries yeah because as I'm learning as I'm getting older people pleasers I mean I I'm quite I have quite a strong personality but people pleasers also allow people to work walk all over them because people pleasers don't like conflict just they just want to get the job done yeah I I'm absolutely a people pleaser I seek to impress so I do try I do fall into that category but I think as you get older you do start learning some boundaries and throwing in a few no's here and there which do feel uncomfortable but I but it's it feels good but it feels good to say no it feels good to say no. But the next you know the generations after me I mean they are they're not even close to being people pleasers they don't and and and quite often as someone older you we can be offended by it because but it's not offended by for any other reason but we just wish we could do the same. Like like I my daughter you know she's 17 and I just love the fact that she has the confidence to have those strong boundaries like I don't get offended by it. I am thankful for it and I'm somewhat a little bit jealous that she just does it so easily where I find it so hard. So when we look at different generations quite often it's not discussed it's just that something missing in ourselves that we wish we had a little bit more of yeah it's just I I I think I think it just has to do with a generation yeah yeah yeah last question and hopefully it's okay to to ask it because I'm again curious how is automation going to affect offshore do we are we do we as business owners need to enable our offshore teams to use more automation or should we be enabling ourselves to use more automation or a balance or is it too early to say no good question and I'm not an expert so I can only give you my opinion I believe that us onshore should probably utilize automation utilizing it not letting it do the work for you still use your brain I use it but I but I input my ideas or or restructure or to but not not to do the whole thing for me when using offshore if you're going to expect offshore to utilize automation you may as well just use automation full stop offshore are people that they are human beings they are staff members that you can still speak with and they are delivering what the property manager or the or the client is are is instructing them to do.

SPEAKER_01 51:41

Okay so they're not a robot and as I said if that was the case and you expected that so so what why why are you using offshore anyhow and and a lot of our virtual assistants as well you know you we can set them up on a with a soft phone that they can make phone calls on your behalf

Automation Limits And Human Teams

SPEAKER_01 52:09

they can receive phone calls and to me maybe because I'm quite personable I still like to have that interaction with you know with with a with a offshore with a virtual assistant. Yeah but you know sometimes I'm having two hour chats with uh with chat GBT and you know chat gpt has gotten to know me and has said and I'm asking for like dating advice or something and the other night chat said to me I think I think I came home from a date and and chat said to me Tanya you know what you're like you know because I pay for it you know you know your expectations and I think it was like about one o'clock in the morning and then chat said to me it's getting late you need to go to the gym at 5 30 go to sleep and let me know how your day is tomorrow I love that another girlfriend of mine she'd finished her she's doing like like uni you know as a as an adult she finished and she called me and she said Chachu BT just made me cry because because it's congratulations I'm so proud of you you know even it's not a real person.

SPEAKER_03 53:32

No no no I did I remember putting something in it a while ago and it was something that I had seen online that I was a bit frustrated at and and it and it did it actually was actually surprisingly really good and it pulled me into line just to say is that really the issue or is it this that's the issue? Yeah and I was like yes that is yeah that's really not the issue it was there was something else underlying and um and I was and it just helped me just not again spent small stuff and it wasn't a big drama you know but it's it's quite good. But it's I guess for me like I asked the questions because I do really want to understand you know I I love hearing people's opinions I love hearing what your thoughts are and and that's really very much the the what's the word I'm looking for but you know the God I can't even think of the word that I want to use but that's sort of like you know the the PM collective way is that that relevancy, staying one step ahead, understanding the other industries, what's happening in your industry, what are you concerned about, what are you excited about, really allows businesses to stay relevant and to to keep that in mind when they're making decisions as well. And we we do have to understand what's going on but with you know offshore and automation and all of that. But I also think it's important to mention that we can have personal opinions and we can have professional opinions as well. And there's a lot of things that I do in my business that personally I don't want to do. I I don't for example I don't agree with working from home. So personally I don't agree with it but professionally it doesn't actually make any difference in the business. It's what we need to do to stay relevant. And so I'm I'm pretty good at putting my personal opinion aside for the business and compartmentalizing that which I don't think a lot of people uh you know do a great job of and and you know offshore is another example people will be out there and they'll have a personal opinion and it's absolutely fine to have a personal opinion but there's also a professional opinion as well is this going to be better for your business and for your career is this something that's going to be relevant to keep you relevant is this something needed in the future because if it is I'm sorry you're just gonna have to soughen it up a little bit and make these changes I just feel like people need to really separate that thought and justify it in a business sense I think so I think so as well and you know I just really think going back to just being a good property manager and and about and we're talking about experience and and delivery landlords and tenants you know they are educated enough I think to be able to pick and choose who who they want and if they're not you know and also when I'm I'm a member of like a lot of like local local pages on on on Facebook and probably once or twice a week there's people even that are saying hey do you know any good property managers in the area because you know my one has failed me what are you doing to make it fall through the cracks is it because coming back to what I'm doing is it because you're too busy typing leases is it because you're too busy doing this you know did you forget to call your landlord back because your head is buried you know in all your paperwork why are you doing paperwork when you've had 25 well yeah you know I had to like I had to do it when I when I when I went back but I felt like you know and and like no to disrespect if there's any you know employees or managers listening who like who may who made me do it but and and I never think that I'm that I'm better than anyone else but my strengths are dealing with people and relationship building so you know 20 when I went back to it yeah I was like 25 years experience why am I doing an ingoing inspection why am I doing why why am I doing a lease renewal why am I senting out rent increases my job is to speak with the landlord to negotiate how much would you like to increase the rent?

SPEAKER_01 58:03

How about we renew the lease because legislations you know once a year this and that my job is still to provide that service to the landlord to ensure that they are getting the best return ever. But the landlord doesn't know that I'm typing that the landlord at the end of the day remembers and remember what I said remembers that their property manager gave them the best return with all these interest rate rises that they deserve that they deserve they don't care who's typing the lease all they want at the end of the day is the final result.

SPEAKER_03 58:45

Yeah no different to doing a making a phone call and then confirming it in the email you're the one making the phone call and then the offshore is you know is doing the paperwork behind it. It's exactly the same thing. Yeah. Right and then that's it and then off on to the next landlord onto the next landlord on to the next tenant you know yeah exactly so Tanya I I've just had those people walk in that I had told you we're going to walk in so let me just quickly so just in that room thank you. So it was an absolute pleasure to chat with you. I um I sometimes when I reach out to people I can just tell just you know

How To Reach Tanya

SPEAKER_03 59:24

by their socials and all of that like they they're very you know similar minded to me. And so I am really really delighted that we did get to connect on here because I yeah share a lot of the same thoughts as you and appreciate your time. I know that we've gone a little bit over but that's okay. It's always good to to chat to people. So appreciate the time I'm sure we'll connect again soon and what's the best way for people to connect with you if they want to reach out they can they can either email me so it's tanya t a n ia at up systems so it's upsystems.com dot you or they can they can phone me and my phone number is 0 double four nine 903206 amazing or if you want some catering done it's Pani Antipas to yeah I love that awesome so good well very happy to connect with you thank you for your time and I'll speak to you soon thank you