Temping, Leave Cover & After Hour Mobiles

We sit down with Kallista Tzirvelakis of KPM Resolve to unpack the real work of temping in property management, from month-long assignments to inbox triage and after-hours coverage. We share practical rules for Christmas shutdowns, boundary setting, and how to keep trust anchored to the agency, not one person.

• why temps protect portfolios and team wellbeing
• when to use temps for leave, recruitment and training
• realistic durations and expectations for temp assignments
• Christmas shutdown coverage that respects real leave
• after-hours options that reduce burnout and risk
• triaging a new portfolio starting with arrears
• inbox management from oldest-first with urgent scans
• phone-first communication followed by email records
• shifting client trust from PM to agency continuity
• how to announce staff changes without drama
• growth plans for regional temp coverage and capacity

Connect with Kallista Tzirvelakis at kallista@kpmresolve.com.au

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Chapters

• 0:00 Meet Callista And KPM Resolve
• 3:01 Why Temping Exists And Typical Assignments
• 8:16 When To Bring In A Temp
• 13:51 Christmas Shutdown And Who Picks Up The Phone
• 21:42 After-Hours Boundaries That Actually Work
• 28:32 First Week In A New Portfolio
• 34:12 Phone Calls Vs Emails And Continuity
• 40:02 Communicating Staff Changes Like A Pro

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:34

Welcome to another episode for the Art of Property Management with another fresh guest today. I'm always excited to bring some fresh guests that haven't been on before. And joining me, I have Callista from KPM Resolve. And welcome. First of all, thank you. Thanks for having me. Now, can I get you to give everyone that's listening a bit of a brief history on your career, where it is now, and where you have come from?

SPEAKER_01: 0:58

Absolutely. Well, I started in property management back in 2007. I fell into property management. I started off as receptionist, as you know, some people do. A year into that role, I felt like I needed to do a little bit more and more challenging, diverse role. So a property management position came up. So obviously I put my hand up. Director put me straight in there. And I guess the rest is history. 19 years later, I'm still doing it. And, you know, this February last year, I started my own business, uh, temping myself out. So it's gone really well. So yeah, I started off with, you know, reception, assistant property manager, property manager, senior property manager, and I'm I'm here now.

SPEAKER_00: 1:41

It's a really interesting space for temping world because it's not something that has like it, I feel like it could be a much larger industry. But it I don't know about you, maybe you see more than I do, but I'm not noticing that it's a big part of property management or the industry at the moment.

SPEAKER_01: 2:00

And I do see that as well. I see a lot of agencies trying to find obviously permanent staff full-time straight away, and they don't really think about putting on a temp in the interim. So yeah, you're right in that. I do see that as well.

SPEAKER_00: 2:14

The well, there's so much I want to talk to you about with temping. Sorry, we'll talk a little bit about it before getting into the topic. But I'd love to find out how how long would an average temping assignment be? Are you finding that it's like singular days? Is it just a week? Can it be up to a couple of months? Is there a maximum or a minimum that you would do?

SPEAKER_01: 2:36

Well, so far it's been minimum a month. My longest one's been four months. I've got one coming up two months. So it varies, but it's pretty much months as opposed to days or weeks. There was the occasional uh come in for a day or so, but generally it is a little longer.

SPEAKER_00: 2:54

Yeah, because I think as well, there's a lot of people that like the idea of being a temp because, you know, in the property management world, just before we press record, I was telling you all the fun stuff that was happening in our office today. So I can see why property managers might go, you know what, a temp position sounds so ideal because I maybe they wouldn't feel like they have to take on as much of the burden because they know that there's an end to it. But I think that the people that I have seen do temp temporarily have always just gone back into the role full time. It's not, I don't know if it's as glamorous as what it sounds like it is.

SPEAKER_01: 3:37

Probably new it is, but you're right, it is hard work because generally you're going into a portfolio that might need a little bit of cleaning up, let's just say. So, yes, you're right, it is not as glamorous as one thinks, but overall I'm generally loving it because it is, I guess, a diverse role and I get to meet lots of people and deal with lots of officers and directors. But yeah, very, very challenging where I'm mostly trying to catch up on items that may have been put on the back burner for some time.

SPEAKER_00: 4:09

It reminds me of like people that say they'd like to be an air hostess because it sounds so fun and you get to travel around. But I think if you ask every air hostess, it's a pretty crap job.

SPEAKER_01: 4:20

Yeah, I do watch a lot of TikToks, unfortunately. And I do see a lot of I follow a lot of flight attendants that um I see, you know, they they they show the the good parts, but then they like, oh, I quit today. Oh yeah, it's not as glamorous as one thinks.

SPEAKER_00: 4:35

No, no, absolutely. And the other question that I've got in that space, are you finding majority of people looking for temps? Are they hiring them for covering leave or covering transition for during recruit the recruitment phase? Or are they using a temp to do like a task-based ad hoc project in the office? Both really.

SPEAKER_01: 4:59

More so someone's left and they're trying to fill a role. So I'm filling in and keeping that portfolio going until they find permanent stuff. But having said that, I have been in a role where I'm following up on our outdated tasks as well. So yeah, and I've also been doing training on new team members. So I've done a bit of everything really.

SPEAKER_00: 5:21

So if the if the if they're bringing you in as a temp through recruitment, that sounds pretty cool for you to be able to train in the new person and take that off the business owner's plate. Is that how it works? Yeah, like that.

SPEAKER_01: 5:36

I love it. It's it's such a smart move because you can't rely on the stuff that are already there because they're busy enough as it is, managing their portfolios. Sometimes the directors don't know anything about property management, so they can't train. So fantastic. I you know, bring in a temp that's been doing it for years, get your you know, juniors trained up by them, and they learn on the job. It's fantastic. And I'm not they're not bothering anyone else.

SPEAKER_00: 6:03

No, I love that. I think that's something that we see, and I have to say that I probably took too long to actually pay proper attention to it. And we use a temp for as much annual leave as we can. We sort of have a bit of a rule that if someone's off on leave just for a couple of days, we just sort it out internally. But if it's more than say like seven days, definitely 14 days, we will bring in a temp. But I will be honest, it's not something that I've always done in business. It's only been really recently that we've needed to do that in terms to really keep that happy culture. And for us, because we don't have a recruitment issue as such, we don't tend to have um any transition issues there. But the leave cover, my team more on the mature side. So they do like cruises and things like that. So they're tending to do leave for like anywhere between two weeks and six weeks. And you just can't put that pressure on the rest of the team. And if you did, it's it's not really fair. And I guess if someone's listening to this, I would love for them to reflect a little bit on what they're doing to their team by expecting everyone to cover. I I would love to say that people are pretty good, but I think that if business owners were doing the right thing and bringing in leave cover and bringing in transition cover, there would be more temps out there than what there is. So that tells me that because there's not a huge amount of temps, people aren't doing it.

SPEAKER_01: 7:40

Exactly. You're exactly right. And I mean, I've been doing this for 19 years now. I've never worked in an agency where a temp's been brought in for someone's leave that goes from you know, say four to six weeks. We everyone else had to pick up that portfolio as well, which is, you know, it's not it's not great sometimes.

SPEAKER_00: 7:59

It's very stressful. Yeah, absolutely. And even if you do separate and go, okay, well, this person can take the diverted phone, this person can do the emails, and this person can do the inspections. And you think as a business owner, you're doing the right thing because you're divvying it up, yeah, it it's still it's still going to be an issue. It's yeah, it's the best thing that we've ever done with the temp. I um I've got one going on leave soon, and one of the other ladies was actually happy to, she's pretty under control, was happy to cover it. And my PM was like, can we have can we have our temp do mine again? Because she loved it so much. Beautiful. When you get that good relationship with someone, which I'm sure you've got with you know your agencies, and you know their systems, you you know, you speak like them, you represent the company like them. It's and you just fit in. It's just amazing. Yep, just slide in, just yeah, keep going with it. Now, one of the great things about you is you go into obviously lots of offices, so you've got experience with how different offices are running, which I think is incredible insight to really have and to be able to provide feedback to the rest of the industry as well, with you know what you're, you know, maybe what you're seeing or with trends and what's working, what's not working, and what you know the good agencies are doing as well. And one of the topics we wanted to talk about today was about the leave cover, but particularly over that Christmas time. And there was an interesting video on TikTok recently, which I want to sort of, you know, have that conversation with you about because it was the video was around an office having been closed between Christmas and New Year. And they had advised all the tenants that they on leave, this is the instructions for emergencies and maintenance, did all the right things. Um property managers had a nice time off and didn't need to be checking their phones or emails. They come back to work when the office opens in January to an IRA tenant who was really, really upset about not being able to get hold of anyone over Christmas. Yep. The question is, is are property managers allowed to have time off and put responsibility on tenants, or that's not our job? Like I I've got an opinion, but I'd love to hear your opinion sort of on that sort of situation.

SPEAKER_01: 10:25

Yeah, I feel strongly about this because property management does not stop. Arrears always have to follow up arrears, landlords need to get paid, maintenance needs to be done, emergencies happen. However, employees deserve to have a break as well. And during that period, it's pretty much forced annual leave and shut down. And you're not, you're getting paid annual leave, you know, and you're forced to take it. And I believe if you're forced to take your annual leave, you shouldn't be attending to emails, calls, or anything else. That should be picked up either by a temp or someone that comes in and looks after that over that two-week period, or the director takes over and attends to that. The other way you can do it is just offer, offer, you know, that time to your employees if they want to work during that time. You don't take their annual leave. You you allow them to work because they've put their hand up, they're happy to because they may want to go on holidays, January, February, March, and they're happy to work over that two weeks and they're monitoring everyone's emails, maintenance arrears, and and everyone's happy.

SPEAKER_00: 11:32

Yeah, I share exactly the same as you. I I think that as a director, as a business owner, the it it stops with you. And if your team was to have that time off, 100% if that's what you want them to do and you want them to take the the whole Christmas off, but I don't believe that that means that phone calls can just go through to message bank um and emergency is not monitored. I think 100% in that step, and and maybe they did it or maybe they don't. I actually don't know those details, and so I don't want to sort of suggest that they didn't do it, but I would absolutely say that in that email going out, it would be in the event of an emergency, please contact this number, and that would be the number for the director, or the property managers would divert their mobiles, which is I find it easier. The only problem with diverting emails is sometimes people do do text messages and you can not get them come through. But it stops with the business owner, and it does the problem we've got is that we've got sales-led business owners that don't want to do it.

SPEAKER_01: 12:42

Yes, yep. It's it's the pressures put on the property managers to do it. Uh unfortunately, I've yeah, again, I've worked many years in the industry, and I don't think I have ever had a real proper butt break until I've started my own business and I obviously give myself a break and I don't have to attend to emails and phone calls, but I I do feel I feel bad because I know I know how it is.

SPEAKER_00: 13:07

Yeah. The and and I always say as well, like you know, with sales-led directors, it's it's not a problem that you love sales and don't love property management, but you have to bring someone in that does love it. So if you don't want to do that role, that's fine. Yep, but employ someone who does. Yes, it doesn't mean you don't have you don't you just don't have anyone in that position. Yeah, exactly right. So then going down to oh, sorry, and actually I was gonna also what you were saying with the optional cover, that's how we work in our office. So it's optional for the team whether they want to take annual leave over that time or not. And very, very surprisingly, it's always 50-50. 50% of them say yes, I want leave, and they have permission to divert their phone over. And then 50% of them are like, no, I'd rather work. Now, I think they're actually smarter working, to be honest, because we still say the office is closed because to the to the public eye it is, but it's still relaxed. You don't have to feel pressured to return phone calls the same day because no one expects that over the time, but just keep an eye on it. Same with your emails, ticket over. You don't have to work from I probably shouldn't say this out loud, they don't have to really work eight hours a day, but they're on what I consider on call and on call, they should still be paid for eight hours because they are on call for eight hours, regardless of whether they're working. So with 50-50 working and 50% taking leave, then obviously they can divert the phone over to the others. And that has always worked really well. I um I actually don't like the idea of forced leave and making people take leave, but I think that there the law does allow a certain number of days a year that you can do that. But I don't know, I wouldn't want that to happen to me, so I don't do it to other people.

SPEAKER_01: 15:01

Yep, I know. But it's majority do it. That's the thing. Most agencies close down. I'm not saying all they all close down, but most of the ones I work for have closed down.

SPEAKER_00: 15:13

But it only, I mean, I know there's lots of public holidays, but it it's taking it out of proper holiday time during the year. I know.

SPEAKER_01: 15:22

And there's nothing worse coming back from break, and you've got 200 emails, and some of them are quite urgent. Yeah. It's like, oh god.

SPEAKER_00: 15:52

I think that's what we find is the ones that don't take it. They're the ones that don't really cope with having many emails in the inbox. So yeah, the idea of coming back, like you said, yeah, that scares them so much. Yeah. Um, while we're sort of on the topic of leave, let's have a little bit of a talk about after hours mobiles because it's something that I see a lot in the forums. What are you, what are different options that you have experienced officers doing with managing after hours?

SPEAKER_01: 16:23

The last job I worked at, the after hours, I believe it went to uh the maintenance guy, the the handyman, and he dealt with any emergencies. Get out. That's a great idea. It is a great so he had he had the responsibility of calling the landlords when maintenance came through, and he and he dealt with it, uh, which I thought was a great idea. I've never seen that before. No, another agency I worked with is uh if anyone called after hours, uh it would go to director who we who was in property management, not yeah, not the sales director, but a property management director.

SPEAKER_00: 17:05

Are you talking about an office phone being diverted or property managers diverting their mobiles? Office phone. Yeah. So what about then mobile phone management? What sort of things have you seen with that?

SPEAKER_01: 17:18

Every property manager has their own mobile, and you you'll get calls from your tenants and landlords after hours, it'll be up to you whether you answer it or not.

SPEAKER_00: 17:29

Yeah, yeah. I just I I part of me wants to say that if you go into a property management role, there is it is a lifestyle choice. And I don't think if you are a nine o'clock till five o'clock and you don't want to have any flexibility at all, yeah. I just I think I find another job. I just don't know. Unfortunately, it's like that.

SPEAKER_01: 17:57

Yeah. And a lot of the new generation, new PMs, they are nine to five generally. And once five o'clock hits, mobile goes off, emails get turned off, phone gets turned off, and we'll see you 9 a.m. tomorrow morning. Whereas I think the older school would have a look and and answer and text. And I'm speaking from experience anyway, it's something I do. Yeah. But that's just that's just me.

SPEAKER_00: 18:24

And part of me wants to also, you know, part of me wants to say, good on them for being so good with their boundaries. Yes. Like there is a part of that I do admire that. I do admire.

SPEAKER_01: 18:36

Yes. And I'm like, I wish I could do it, but I can't.

SPEAKER_00: 18:40

No, no. And oh random story, but I've got this barber that one of my kids goes to, and it's run by some really cool, young, chattered, you know, mid-20 year old guys. Okay. And it's a really cool place. The guys are cool, they're so lovely. You know, when Angus goes in to get his hair cut, they just chat nicely to him. Really nice barber. But I went in there last year and they pulled me aside and they said to me, if you're not going to get your kids' haircut every four weeks, you can't book in for a kid's haircut. You have to book in for a full adult restyle. Right. And I was like, Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't, he's under 13. I just, you know, didn't even know. There was no site no anything on their website that had mentioned that. So I was like, I'm sorry. So and I left and I was like, that's a bit ballsy, like he's 12 years old.

SPEAKER_01: 19:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 19:33

And I didn't think much of it. And then I had we've been away for a while, went to go get his hair cut, and it was quite a bit, you know, hadn't been cut for about eight weeks, I reckon. And and I was like, maybe because I thought maybe it was just that guy that I got on the day that was like that. It is like it's like can and I the next guy said to me, pulled me aside again, he goes, Listen, we're quite today, so it wasn't a problem. But just so you know, in future, if you don't get his hair cut every four weeks, then then next time someone might actually refuse to cut his hair because they haven't allowed enough time. And he goes, but don't worry about it today. And I was like, Oh, sorry, I pretended I didn't know. Said sorry again. And I left and I was having a chat to Angus about. I was like, you know, part of me loves the boundaries. I love that they're consistent with their messaging throughout their business. Yeah, I love the confidence in sticking to it and telling me as a client that that's not acceptable. Like I love that. And even though I was getting a little bit like, you know, also a little bit frustrated at it, I think I was just frustrated at it because I I want to sometimes do that too. Yeah. And I I think that if we can reframe the way that we see potentially, you know. younger people who use it for the example having those boundaries and and it's very easy for us to say, you know, they shouldn't be, you know, shouldn't be in the role if they don't want to uh be flexible. There is a little bit I think that makes me feel like that because I want to be like that too.

SPEAKER_01: 21:10

Yeah. No, I I think it's very important to set boundaries, uh, especially at the start. Otherwise you're you are going to be a 24-7 service. And people are going to expect calls back straight away, emails, you know, returned straight away. And um it's it's it's gonna it's gonna lead to burnout if it just continues like that.

SPEAKER_00: 21:30

Yeah. I think as well there's two parts to it. And I always try to reflect sort of on on my business journey, but if we there are going to be people listening where they're going to be you know reflecting it all back on the the you know the business owner and and Riley so that you know they might say we've got an issue in our office with after hours mobiles and I'm getting burnt out and no one's taking my phone for me and the business owner won't and we can we can go down that road if we want to but we can also go the other side and say why are we getting the phone calls in the first place? Like do we need to focus on that because my team look after their mobiles after hours on the weekends, in the evenings, all of that. And they've always been doing that. Every now and then I might get a team member who is a little bit you know just feeling that little bit burnt out not because of the after hours but just because of life. And then we say to them okay you know for future weekends you know divert to me on a Friday night and redo it on a on a Monday and that's fine. Very ad hoc only every now and then but the reason why it's not been a pain point in our business is because we don't get a lot of after hours phone calls. Yes exactly right and you generally don't yeah you generally don't no I reckon we would probably if I I mean do you know every now and then you do sometimes get a run like there might be a couple of weekends where I'd have one or two phone calls each weekend for like two weekends in a row but then nothing for like six weeks and then you might get a random one and that's on a big portfolio as well. So yeah I think I think the question to ask people that feel like they've got an issue with after hours mobiles is why do you have an issue with after hours mobiles? Where's the boundaries with clients? Because going back to that you know hairdresser story that they they put the boundary with me. They've had to put it in twice because you know you don't always listen the first time and tenants don't listen the first time but I've got the message and I'm not going to do it the third time I will make sure that his haircut is done every every four weeks or I'll just book it in for the proper wrist style. So you do need a trial things or like you do need to reiterate it to people multiple times like me until they get the message but if you keep on doing that with boundaries people will get the message going to be consistent. Absolutely consistency is key now with all the offices that you go into what do you find the biggest not the big I don't want to say the biggest problem I want to be more specific. What do you find you have to clean up the most when you go into an office is it generally maintenance arrears email backlog what do you find is the biggest thing you always need to tackle all a bit of everything a bit of everything.

SPEAKER_01: 24:41

Yeah maintenance is a big one tasks arrears yep no a bit of it's diverse a bit of everything there's nothing really they're all exactly the same at the moment.

SPEAKER_00: 24:52

Yeah okay so as someone who goes into temp and maybe this would be really great to hear for people that are stepping into a new portfolio yes what what would the first steps be in the first week of taking over a portfolio how do you even start where do you start how do you compartmentalize like what you do good good question I start where I think is most needed and what's most important and what for me important is arrears.

SPEAKER_01: 25:25

Yeah I try and tackle that first because if a landlord doesn't get paid no good then I obviously tackle emails because somewhere in there there's going to be urgent stuff so I need you need to prioritize check all the emails make sure you know you attend to those urgent matters the the rest can wait and stop on stop on emails.

SPEAKER_00: 25:46

When you do your emails I love talking about inbox management do you start from the bottom the oldest ones and then work up or do you start from the the most recent and go down I generally start from the bottom up okay the older ones and then yeah and the rest can wait a little longer.

SPEAKER_01: 26:06

But I do I do quickly skim over the the recent ones just to make sure there's nothing urgent but I'll try and clean up the bottom ones first and work up. Yep.

SPEAKER_00: 26:14

Yeah interesting I I I start from the top the most recent ones and go down and only and it's good that you skim but only because like sometimes it's already been dealt with and then at the top is like the third email chain. Yep. And then you like get down to the bottom like sweet I can like you know move across the whole heap of them. I know some people who start at the bottom of the emails but so strictly that they don't even scan the rest of them. So what happens is then they respond to the bottom emails but it's already been dealt with but because they're so strict with that they're missing out.

SPEAKER_01: 26:52

Yep and that's why it's very important to keep notes and tasks and just so when someone else you know jumps in they know exactly where they need to follow on from very important.

SPEAKER_00: 27:04

Notes and notes and comments is probably the biggest thing that I struggle with people utilizing. And I don't I don't know why because like don't we all just forget stuff like don't we all have to write it down for our own personal benefit?

SPEAKER_01: 27:21

No one can remember everything. It's impossible and with today's technology you can save emails in say property tree property me you can save everything you can document everything. So so why not? Yeah just do it and oh I can't stand going into emails and and you haven't categorized them you haven't created folders and they just all sit in there 5000 emails from back in 2021.

SPEAKER_00: 27:46

Yeah just put it put them away read them action them put them away I love an empty inbox that's what I aim to do in every portfolio I get into you know if I would if I was to ever tend which I won't be but if I was to ever tend I reckon like I would just want to get stuck into the the inbox I reckon there would be like a job just for like an actual role for me I just do inbox cleanups. I just come in and clean make it look pretty and move stuff. Yep there's a job in that love it love it love it that's a job in itself absolutely I would yeah I would get so much satisfaction out of doing that it's ridiculous. So you mentioned arrears um first then emails you get them under control and then get stuck into maintenance which you'd probably find a lot of the maintenance would be on the emails anyway. How and my last question for you because again this is relevant for people that are stepping into a new role in a new portfolio as well but how do you find that it's how do I word this is it better for the office you're working for to make the phone calls or the emails and the reason why I ask is because I can see the benefit of doing emails in a temp role because you're not you sort of don't want to create too much of a relationship and you want the trail and stuff but then you know phone calls is always best so any uh thoughts on managing phone calls versus emails as a temp yeah as a temp first I prefer phone calls personally I just introduce myself uh I just say I'm I'm filling in for the time being I'm helping out in the department and and no one really asks any questions to be honest.

SPEAKER_01: 29:41

I think they're quite used to staff turnover in a lot of offices so I'm just like another employee basically so I do prefer phone calls because it kind of gets things done quite quickly.

SPEAKER_00: 29:53

Yeah and follow followed up of course with emails yeah I I can I can see the benefit of the the phone calls especially if there's any stress with people having high changeovers as well in that space it I think moving forward in the industry with staff changeover I just think we could potentially handle it a little bit different and to the public eye it's such one of those pain points in our industry where you see on those Facebook groups, you know, my property manager changes over six months and you know all of the negativity around it. But imagine if we could create it so it wasn't actually a negative thing that the management of the property wasn't held with the property manager. The management of the property was seen more as the agency. So it doesn't matter who's doing the actual legwork it's the agency that is staying consistent. I feel like we could do that better. Absolutely good point.

SPEAKER_01: 30:58

And that's why temping's great because they just they just keep you know things going. And a lot of landlords as long as everything's running smoothly they're not really going to care who's looking after it. As long as they're communicated with that's the main thing.

SPEAKER_00: 31:13

I agree because there is so many types of people you know the task based and there are situations where owners have multiple people to deal with and I agree I don't know whether people actually really care that much as long as like you said the job gets done and they've got confidence in the agency. So focusing on more agency confidence and property management confidence would be really good for us yeah as an industry to pay more attention on. We recently had a new BDM and my previous one was with us for three years. She's sort of gone into semi-retirement even though she's not old enough to retire but she she is to look after young kids and she new lady started and I got some feedback from the new BDM and she was saying how everyone all the new clients that she's been taking over for their um business have been lovely. They haven't even really asked any questions about where the previous one is and it's because the new BDM is just onto it. She's just she she's got confidence she deals with the answers what they need to um and no one's even asking the question or questioning their decision. And I I think that as an agency I'm proud of that because that's sort of where I want yeah people to have like it is a business owner's uh responsibility I believe to have those relationships with your clients and we put a lot on the property manager which is great for a property manager but for a business owner yeah you want to protect your business and your rent role.

SPEAKER_01: 32:44

Exactly right and I think it's very important if someone does leave it's good to communicate that and just let the landlords know and tenants know that that person's moved on but your property's still being looked after as it should just so you know they're they're confident in what you you're about to about to do basically.

SPEAKER_00: 33:03

Yeah it that's I have dabbled with so many different ways of communicating it to clients. Yep and I definitely have had times where I've emailed them exactly like you said emailed them and say you know change over I haven't liked to email them when there's no uh when the new person hasn't been employed so I don't like saying someone's left and we'll keep you in touch. I don't like that but um but I have to admit there's been times that I've been so embarrassed that I've not said anything to the clients and I've just ticked it all over and jumped in and I know that that's bad. But from someone who has done both ways let clients know and not let clients know I have to say there's actually not much of a difference in terms of there's probably either side I would say on a normal portfolio size I would have let's call it three to five owners that would have a bit of a whinge either way. Okay. If I was telling them or if I wasn't telling them yeah so yeah not not saying that there's a right or a wrong way to do it but I've tried both and I haven't noticed much difference. Well that's good that's good. Absolutely generally because I jump in to the portfolio and put my name on there so they're like oh okay Ash is doing it so what you know well that's a backup plan isn't it yeah correct just just tell anyone to put my name at the bottom of the email and send it and everyone will be happy but but yeah like I just that's I I think I have seen some people some business owners send horrible emails out to their landlords when a property manager has left and there is malice in it there is you know like it you know really vindictive like the property manager you know Sarah Smith has been has finished with our agency with effect immediately and blah blah blah and I'm like really why why would you do that like what a horrible email to send not only on you know I don't care what your property manager did you don't send an email like that but also for a prop a an owner to receive it's like okay you're getting a little bit emotional about it like who's in control here that doesn't give me a sense of control yeah someone throwing their toys out of the cot like that and I see that quite a lot I don't have you ever seen that uh no I can't say I have yeah that would be awful yeah it's not a good way to go about things absolutely not yeah yeah there's some shopping just got to put your feelings aside whatever the you know the story is no one needs to know and you don't need to air out your dirty laundry just just move on and and fix fix the problem. That's right and like the next email that you send to the client will you know when someone's left would should always be we're so excited that Sarah Smith has joined our team and she brings this much experience like yep that's that email perfectly fine don't go doing a little negative Nancy email prior I I only say it because I I just I'm so shocked sometimes at what I see people do and you you know you want to think that people do the right thing and and but they they don't yep it's unfortunate so the more we talk about it and the more we you know have those conversations hopefully people will maybe second guess what they're doing if they're listening to it next time they feel the need to do it hopefully there's a little voice in them that go Ash and Callista were talking about this on a podcast maybe I should second guess it let's hope now tell me sort of what's next for you and your business like you do you have any personal business goals or um yeah obviously my goal is probably to grow my business I would love to employ someone that has got the same work ethics as me and works just like me just so I can even you know in different suburbs because I work in the northwest so it'd be ideal to find someone maybe in the east south that that can do exactly what I'm doing because I've had to say no to a few agents because I'm I'm locked in a contract.

SPEAKER_01: 37:42

So that's that's where I'm I want to head to and I've been quite busy since February. So I know there's a demand out there. I've just got to find others that you know want to do what I do.

SPEAKER_00: 37:53

Yeah the right person I think it'd be great if there was someone who like I love that you do longer assignments with it which is great but I can see how that locks up a lot of your time. Yeah it'd be great to have someone on board that was that specialized in those week two weeks and the shorter so they can service more people. Absolutely 100% I agree. Oh okay we'll have to do a little lookout for you and um I can't wait to sort of see that next stage because like I said if if if more people were doing the right thing there would be bigger demand for temping. I mean there already is a big demand for temping but you know there's a lot of opportunity there and I think it's wonderful to have you in the industry doing it. So very thankful for that and I yeah love watching you on socials. So I'm a huge fan where what's the best platform for our people to connect with you what's your favorite platform to use I think it would have to be Instagram at the moment yeah amazing Instagram is always a good one. So for those of you that haven't yet connected with Callista go over to let me quickly bring it up Callistapropertymanagement. That's nice and easy Callista.property management and that's the KPM resolve go over and give her a follow because you do some great content as well so I love watching what you do and thank you your selfies where people walk in is always fun to watch as well. Thank you so much. Thanks for jumping on and we'll talk to you soon.

SPEAKER_01: 39:27

Oh thank you so much for having me. Bye