PM Collective - The ART of property management
The ART of property management with Ashleigh Goodchild is a leading platform supporting collaboration not competition through an online community and events throughout the year with one purpose: to create happier property managers. She creates connections for property managers looking to create momentum in their careers and personal life. Join Ashleigh and her guests as they discuss challenges, struggles, mental health, mindset and give advice to property managers and anyone in the industry. To get the support in your property management career, join our PM Collective Facebook and Instagram community.
PM Collective - The ART of property management
The anti-advice that we want to vent about
Ash and Nikki from Rezzi Strata challenge conventional real estate wisdom with over 45 years of combined industry experience, offering fresh perspectives on success, client relationships, and work-life integration.
• Anti-advice on vacation disconnection: checking emails while away can actually reduce anxiety and prevent overwhelming return pileups
• The myth of needing expensive cars: staying within your means and being authentic matters more than projecting an artificial image of success
• Building genuine relationships with clients creates trust and understanding in both directions, contrary to advice about maintaining strict professional boundaries
• Delegation is essential for growth - documenting processes and trusting your team allows you to focus on client relationships
• "The customer is always right" isn't always true - tactful communication about legal or procedural matters preserves relationships while guiding clients toward better decisions
• Self-care looks different for everyone - find what genuinely helps you relax rather than forcing yourself into prescribed methods
• Values-based decision making helps explain priorities to both clients and family members, especially when explaining choices to children
If you have anti-advice you've been given that you want us to discuss in our next episode, please DM us - we'd love to continue this series!
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All right, welcome to another episode. And we have Nikki from Resistrata joining us today. Welcome, nikki. Hello, thank you for having me Now. We were messaging last night. We're just signing. What are we going to talk about? Because you know we've got there's two different types of podcast guests. There is the guests that need the questions prior, not a problem at all. If you are one of those people and you ever come on the podcast, please just let me know, because I'm not going to willingly give you questions otherwise. And then we have people like yourself where we just go you know what. Let's just have a normal conversation like we would every day.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think there's been many conversations, ash, where you and I have just sat over coffee after a coffee and conversations and debriefed or whatever, and so much value has come out of it and things I've implemented into my business or doing those Strata workshop series we did. So much value comes out of the conversations we had and I think my exact words to you, with a laughing LOL, was I'm pretty confident in our ability to just talk.
Speaker 1:Correct. It's like every time we see each other we should just put a microphone on anyway, and we'll just record our conversations.
Speaker 2:This is about 45 years of real estate experience in the room now.
Speaker 1:Exactly. So what we thought would be really funny is just to maybe have a bit of a chat about, like, just stupid advice or anti-advice that we've been given. That is sort of a bit of a myth, or we just want to, you know, talk it out, because I think what we find is that there is a lot of advice and opinions that are maybe more what's the word socially appropriate to post, and it's very hard sometimes to have a different opinion. So I'm going to throw the first one out, because I've just recently come back from holidays. There is so much advice around you know, make sure that you, you know you clock off when you're on holidays, divert your phone, don't check your emails, close your laptop, you need to take a break, all of that stuff and I get that.
Speaker 1:But I actually don't enjoy that. I actually it makes me more nervous not knowing what's at the other end when I get back from holidays. And I really enjoy checking my emails, like I don't have a problem doing that on holidays. I love diverting my phone, like that's like my thing to do, but emails, not a problem. I am very happy and I had the best holiday knowing that everything was under control. And I came back and there was no pile up. I had a great holiday and it's all just integrated. So that's one of the anti-advice things that I sometimes get. Or people might read clock off when you're on holidays. You know what? If it doesn't work for you, don't feel pressured to.
Speaker 2:I think we're quite similar, ash, in that we're go, go, go and take every opportunity and do the thing. And, you know, when you have the idea, do it now. And I often get told that I work too fast. Or, you know, an idea comes and I'm like, once it's on my to-do list, consider it done. Don't think that I'm going to sit on it and wait, don't be surprised that it's done the next day, kind of thing. And I have to explain that to people sometimes, because what I find is, you know, like what might go on the to-do list they're still thinking about, while I'm like, okay, done.
Speaker 2:And I find, like being productive is, you know, maybe it's the type, a personality or whatever it is but being productive and getting things done makes me feel calm and comfortable. So when we're talking about rest and things like that, I can't actually switch off and rest unless I know that I'm prepared for the next day. And you know I think I mentioned this to you last night when you were saying about that I've had some coaches actually say to me you need to rest and recoup and try and stop me and pull my energy in, and I'm like this isn't how I operate, this isn't how I function. That actually puts me in a place of like panic and anxiety, whilst, you know, after the kids go to bed at night, I like to flick through my emails and see what I've got on the next day. Get anything sorted and out of the way before the morning so I can focus on the needle moving work. Yeah, so I very much agree with you on that. I think there is a place for rest and recoup 100%, and we all do it differently and we all like it in a different way.
Speaker 2:I remember like being told, meditate and do all this meditation and I swear it almost sent me insane. I started meditating so much that I like went so far into it that I was in this like trippy. God knows what subliminal messages are coming through these meditation podcasts. That just doesn't work for me. So chill out is kind of like lay on the bed and doom scroll for five minutes without the kids asking for something Correct. Yeah, actually a tip for me. So chill out is kind of like lay on the bed and doom scroll for five minutes without the kids asking for something Correct, yeah.
Speaker 1:Actually a tip for that. What I do when I need a break from when my kids are smaller is I used to put a face mask on my face like a sheet mask, and I used to lay down and say to the kids oh, I've got a face mask on, I can't talk for 15 minutes because of it, and then they leave you just as an FYI, I've got a daughter.
Speaker 2:She could potentially put one on and not talk for 15 minutes too.
Speaker 1:Do it to her. That's right, and yeah, and that's the thing. Like I guess we're all so different when it comes to the relaxing and you know I'm exactly the same as you I don't find enjoyable. I think there's like so much pressure out there that you should be journaling, much pressure out there that you should be journaling, you should be meditating, you should do this. That's not my type of relaxing, but I do.
Speaker 1:I think one thing that I would identify and say if the family close to you or your team around you are feeling the effect of you being too busy and not taking time to rest, that's when you need to take rest. But if no one's being affected, you've got healthy relationships with the kids, healthy relationship with your team, healthy relationship with your husband it doesn't. Actually, you don't need to stress too much about forcing that time. So I try to add some things into my schedule, but I will be honest, I feel like I'm adding it in because society says you've got to as well, and I think that's where I get caught up. But I will be honest, I feel like I'm adding it in because society says you've got to as well, and I think that's where I get caught up, but I do. For me it's not meditation or yoga, but I have.
Speaker 1:And actually this is a little tip because I know that you live close by there's this place called Tambac. It's a Chinese health place in Vic Park and I just saw it on my little walk last night and they do the. It's all Chinese medicine, but they do the head spas which I've been wanting to try for a while and it was only $88, which I thought was a bargain for an hour and they do that scalp massage with that. You know the head spa that you've got. So I've booked that in for Sunday evening, which I thought was a nice time to do it, and then I've booked Ember Bathhouse. So I'm going to try and do like Ember Bathhouse once a month. But that's like that's all I need. I just need one hour once a month for either a massage, a facial treatment or a bathhouse experience.
Speaker 2:Otherwise I'm happy working my little butt off in between. You're right. And it comes down to like the hype word of self-care and it's like well, then you start stressing and thinking like what does self-care look like? You know, I'm a mum of a 14 month old and a three year old. Self-care to me is being able to wash my hair once a week, you know.
Speaker 2:Correct, exactly I'm happy with like a dark shower and washing my hair. That's great. But I'm also with you Like. I like to take sometimes a little time out of my day whether it be a pedicure or a facial or something little once a month just to recoup and really feel like you're doing something for yourself. Yeah, exactly, and I think self-care and relaxing. Like I said, it looks different for everyone, so you can't hold societal expectation on what works for you.
Speaker 1:Because some people need it daily, some people need it weekly, some people need it monthly. So find, yeah, whatever works for you. And you know what, if meditation is not your thing, don't fucking do meditation. Like it's pretty simple, isn't it? Okay? Next question I've got which I think is super interesting and I've got a story about it, and maybe it's more about sales agents or business owners. But the question is do you need to have a nice car when you want to look like a high performer?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so this is the, and I've been in agencies where the motto has been fake it till you make it. Or, you know, think about what the client thinks when you pull into their driveway and things like that. And we're working in high-end real estate especially. You know, I actually had an old employer convince me to buy an Audi when I was not in a position to buy an Audi. And this takes me back to some other bad advice or we call it bad advice, anti-advice where there used to be a thing back, you know, as a sales agent saying a car won't buy you a house but a house will buy you a car. And I stupidly did the house and bought the car out of my mortgage, so added on to that and it did not work out well for me and it was pointless.
Speaker 2:Like I'm not necessarily one for designer labels and flashy things, like nice things are nice and it's nice to feel and look good. But I'm not going to judge somebody's capability by the car they drive, right, and yes, in some way there is a status thing. And you're looking at selling Sunset and you know, okay, the shows have made a reality for many these days of what real estate looks like. But this has been happening for years. You know the whole Selling Sunset vibe and the image you have to present and the fake it till you make it, and all of that I'm like. I think there's something to be said in authenticity.
Speaker 1:But is there a limit? You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Would you rock up in your you know, 1984 Camira or something?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, Like I think there still has to be like a limit and boundaries, but maybe not as stupid as what you know as getting something too expensive. Do you still have the Audi.
Speaker 2:No, no, and it was. Oh my goodness. I ended up selling the property that I had redrawn on to buy the Audi and ended up making a bit of a capital loss on that. So there's an example. Yeah, the Audi like, at the end of the day, other than get me from A to B, it's no different to my RAV4. You know what I mean. And my RAV4 is practical. It's my mum car. It does the trick. It's not like a fancy calibre or whatever. I'm also not a car person. So I do get that some people are actually really into cars and collecting cars and things like that and by all means go for it, but you don't need to push that onto the next person that maybe doesn't care. Yeah, correct.
Speaker 1:And you're right, like I'm, my experience with having a car, so I've always had a decent car. Like I probably don't agree to have a bomb of a car, depending on your role, you know, one that's damaged, faded, all of that, but like a cheap car, not a problem at all. It's a little bit like an investment property. Old investment properties are totally fine as long as they're clean and tidy. I think same goes for a car. However, I had a two-rag before which was a decent mum's soccer my kids would say a soccer mum car and it started costing me quite a lot in petrol.
Speaker 1:So I went down the road of looking for a hybrid car and so I got a hybrid BMW. So it does look nice, but it was also a mid-range for a hybrid option. So hybrid cars can range anywhere between $50,000 and $200,000, for example. So mine was sort of like on the lower end, you know, just under the average. So it was, I think I don't know, maybe $88,000. So I was like, okay, well, that's sort of like in the mid, like I didn't want the bottom end, however, saying that my car that I've got now costs me $200 less per week than me having the two-wag because I'm not filling it up with petrol. So I went from $250 a week in petrol down to gosh. I probably pay $50 a month in petrol. Now I've got a hybrid and I'm about the same and I would not give it up Like.
Speaker 2:I was due to upgrade my car this year and I was like no, I'm paying it out and keeping it because I can't put the value on what I'm not paying in petrol. That's right, and I've got a top of the range model. But I think the point to what you're saying, ash, and the point of this conversation and thinking about it, is do it, have the nice car, but don't go outside of your means for the sake of public perception, absolutely.
Speaker 2:And that's the point of this, like the anti-advice there is convincing someone to stretch themselves or think they need to be more. Do more, just stay within your means. Be authentic, just be you.
Speaker 1:It's okay, yeah, and if that happens to be a nicer car, then do it. What I was disappointed about when I got the car and I remember and this is like your sales mentality I remember rocking up at a property and it happened more than once where a sales agent had said to me, oh, things must be going really well driving around in that nice car, and I was like what a stupid thing to say, and how dare you even say that to me. I was just so offended by that. And I was also offended when someone once said to me I had my bag.
Speaker 1:Now, everyone that knows me, I like receiving nice things. My partner buys me the bags because he thinks that's something that boyfriends should buy. So I get the nice Louis Vuittons or the Saint Laurent bags. But for me, like it's quite funny because I'm sure, because I pack so much shit in my bag and Linz is always like pretty sure, you're not meant to be using the bag like that. It's a display bag, correct? And I just like it's got power cords, the whole lot in it.
Speaker 2:Well, that brings me back to cars, because if you see the way I drive, and I had 11 car accidents in my first year of driving. So I think that's also part of the reason why I'm not like a car person and I like to, you know, look after your things and it's like you said, but keeping it clean and tidy Whilst I'm like I know the way I drive and I'm a klutz, like just keep me on the basic, like I don't need to spend German money on expensive parts.
Speaker 1:Correct, correct, correct. But when people you don't say to you and unfortunately it is a male thing, I think they say to you oh, you must be doing well, you know, that's a nice handbag or that's a nice cut, Like it's. Just don't be that person to say stuff like that, because that's not important to me. Like you might have some, but it's not important.
Speaker 2:Do you know like you hit the nail on the head and not to go down the? You know the feminism path, but it does hit differently. I think, like, whilst a man likes to provide and protect and possess, and you know the three Ps, as they say, so there is an image and a status and to be that, whilst a woman does it, like we don't necessarily have those nice things for it to be perceived like that I'm an independent woman and I look after myself, which is great, but you don't need to comment on that to me.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, and I think from a female point of view I always talk about that. We all have different values. So, like, some people value getting their hair done once a week, some people value getting their nails done every fort week. Some people value getting their nails done every fortnight. Some people value the nice car, some people value the you know, the nice handbags. Some people value looking nice all the time. You know, some people like me I mean, I just I'm happy to dress like a homeless person, like I'm not that worried, like it doesn't. I don't value that too much.
Speaker 2:I actually said, I walk around Vic Park with the mum bun and pretty much in pyjamas. And then I think, like I actually work in this area and like know a lot of people and I walk around like this yeah, I thought about it the other day. But you know, like what we're saying, the value, as long as it's your value. Yeah, like you're not doing it for an image or for other people or because someone's told you that that's the perception it needs to be, and I think that's something as a young and impressionable salesperson or working coming into that industry is really put on you. It's like, oh, the type of shoes you wear, the kind of car you drive, the handbag you've got, and it's very like, very ultra focused and talked about and mentioned and acknowledged. And you know it feels good when someone says, oh, your hair looks nice today. So if someone's making comments, it feels good and that can be an addictive thing.
Speaker 2:But I think to always just come back to your roots, like what actually matters to me, like for me, man, I just want to see the mortgage paid out. I want to have like be debt-free and just live a comfortable life, see the mortgage paid out. I want to have like be debt free and just live a comfortable life. I don't need all the flashy things. Yes, the flashy things are nice and when you can and do afford them or get gifted them.
Speaker 1:you use them and enjoy them, and I think that's what they're there for, but that's just my perception.
Speaker 1:You know, and yeah, and like you know, we say everyone's got their own values. So you surround yourself with people that have those same values and that wouldn't judge you or think differently of you. So, yeah, it's like for me, my sweet spots is food I think yours is probably the same Like I'm very happy to pay hundreds of dollars for a meal, like that's where I put my value because I enjoy that, but that's. I reckon that's probably the only place I place a lot of value in is experience.
Speaker 2:Because I think food is an experience and travel is an experience and I'm very much like I don't need stuff. I want experiences. I'd rather, like I said, I'd rather put all my money down, pay out a mortgage, invest in a business, do things like that, and then be able to afford and enjoy the experiences that come in between. You know, holding a nice handbag every day isn't fulfilling me, but maybe travelling to the other side of the world and a new experience does.
Speaker 1:Yeah, actually, do you know, can we? I hope this is no, this is okay to say. I'm just trying to think whether it's appropriate. So I am, you know, talking about like nice things and stuff like that. And I live in a little character house, it's, you know, it's, it's cool, I love it, it's gorgeous, you know. It's got a 1970s kitchen, like it's like it's my place, it feels beautiful, beautiful.
Speaker 1:But I do remember like so my kids hang out with my ex-partner side, ex-husband's side, where they also know lots of real estate agents. And I remember a few years ago my kids came home to me after spending a weekend at their dad's and they said to me mum, why does this person have this big house on the river and has like a massive mansion and you don't? And I was like I don't know, like I've got what's comfortable for me, you know, and all of that. But it was really interesting, the kids' perception. And then it got me thinking they've probably got a high mortgage and they're probably, you know, like they're probably making like you can't judge people even on that because you don't know someone's personal circumstance. But it was just interesting to be for my kids to bring it up and notice it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Two things that come out of that right yeah, and I grew up as one of those kids that was in the McMansion but not in a high socioeconomic area, so it looked even more, you know, with the community we were in. And two pieces of advice that I'll give that aren't anti-advice, that are actually good advice and they come from my mum, who's like the most down-to-earth, real, present person you'll ever meet. But one was she always used to say when I would ask as a little kid, are we rich? No, darling, we're not rich, we're just comfortable. And that's hitting the nail on the head of what we've just talked about. And the second was not having money won't kill you, but stressing about it will.
Speaker 1:Yes, I love that.
Speaker 2:So there are two things that I sort of live by and it's like do I need it? Can I afford it? Yeah, probably Do I need it. Not really you know what's it going to add value to? Does this mean that I can go to Scotland for a month this year instead?
Speaker 1:And it's a good tip if you've got children, because we had that same conversation with one of my boys and he said this you know, a friend of his has a room full of all these sneakers, like really expensive sneakers, and he goes why do I only have two pairs of shoes? And it was a couple of years ago and I ended up I thought I was pretty good with my answer. I said listen, buddy, I said I could afford to give you a full room of shoes, like that's not the problem, but we don't value that as a family. We don't value having a whole heap of shoes in your closet that you're going to grow out of.
Speaker 1:But we value other things. We do value travel and we value eating out. So I changed it around that because I didn't want to go down the road of we can't afford things, because I'm right into this money mindset at the moment and how we're teaching our children and how it can shape their experience as well. So I'm really enjoying that topic. But yeah, to say it like that I thought was really good because it wasn't talking about how we can't afford it. It's just that we don't value that as a family.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 1:That resonates with me big time, as yours get older and they start questioning.
Speaker 2:It's different becoming a mum too and thinking like that, and it's like you can give them the world and you want to spoil them and whatever. But you don't want them to turn into little rat bags and you want them to understand the value. And we've just gone through the process of selecting school for my little one to start next year, and I've chosen a Catholic school because I went to a Catholic school, not because they teach religion, and I had to explain to my husband it's not religion, they're not going to come home reading the Bible. It's beliefs and values, it's respect and morals. It's the way to treat others and be treated.
Speaker 2:That comes from that system that you might not get yeah be treated that comes from that system that you might not get and that was, and you just hit the nail on the head again with what you're teaching your kids. It's a beliefs and values system. It's not about superficial. It's not about what's on Instagram and what the next influencers putting on their face or how many pairs of shoes your best friend has and competing with that kind of thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Okay, let's get into the next one, because you and I talk and we've had a whole list and we've gone through a couple. Okay, let's go down the anti-advice of don't get too friendly with your clients. What's your thoughts?
Speaker 2:I think that's so anti-advice. So I have built some of the most solid relationships, friendships. You know people I see as family, who started as clients or I've met through the industry and through work and I received that anti-advice at some point. You know, don't get too close, don't socialise, don't do this, don't do that, especially working in the government realm, because it's like you know the perception of receiving gifts or that kind of thing and you know relationships and things like that is very red taped in government. I was at a wedding last weekend I met as a client who was on the Council of Owners eight years ago and the whole nine of the Council of Owners were at this wedding and I was there celebrating with them. I'm not their strata manager anymore, but I became part of that community, like it was a friendship that all remembered me. It was so excited to see me and I've stayed in touch and made really solid friendships. You know go to dinners with their families and it's, it's so nice.
Speaker 2:I'm all about building community. I spin that all the time with regards especially in strata and living in communities and what that should look like and feel like. You know how you should feel in your home and as your strata manager. I'm a part of that. As your real estate agent, I'm a part of this journey. You know like, even if you're a sales rep or you know an investments manager, you're taking people through some very emotional times as well. So you need to have a level of compassion and a level of understanding and that sometimes builds relationships and you do connect. But that's where the trust and the magic happens, because I've got clients for life. I've just built an entire portfolio in three months on referral, because I've built those relationships over the last 20 years.
Speaker 1:But then that works in reverse. So you're saying about how it builds trust and all of that, well, but that's also on and compassion, that's also the same for the client. So that client is going to have more compassion and trust with you, as well as their real estate agent. So, even like something as simple as like my clients, I let them befriend me on Facebook, which is one of those things that I used to always have people say don't add your friends or your colleagues, yeah correct, don't add your clients on your Facebook page.
Speaker 1:But I said yes to it and they can see when I'm on holiday, they can see that I've got children. I love that. Clients will now say, if they call me up at a crappy time, I might say actually, oh my God, I actually just remembered that there's a client that I said that to yesterday and I haven't called her back. I'll remember that when I finish, but knowing that I could say to them hey, I'm just going to go pick up my kids from dance, I'll give you a call back. And they're like yep, no worries, clients love that, Like they love, and they don't want to interfere in your time with the kids as well. So sometimes they might go oh listen, just call me after dinner or call me, you know, after you drop them to school.
Speaker 2:That's a really nice relationship to have with clients, yeah, and look, I've built this business like I've built Resistrata, around being a mum of young kids and a family life. I still, at this point, I'm trying to maintain Mondays with the kids at home and doing activities and things. And clients know that and they know if they call that little Hugo might be squealing in the background for his lunch or whatever, but that I'm still available and I'm still there and I'm still looking and overseeing and if something urgent happens, it's understood. But they also respect and value that my reason and that you have a life outside I think that's part of building relationships with clients and colleagues is that they see you as a human too.
Speaker 2:It keeps that human connection, Like we aren't just robots. You know that was something else we talked about. You know should we be giving advice and recommendations and things like that? You can do that when you've got the experience and the trust and the knowledge. You're not just flicking emails back and forth, so you become a personality to them as much as they do to you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I think that that's going to be something that's going to become even more prevalent as we go further with the clients and getting them to get to know you personally. And you know I always say there's going to be times that you make little mistakes and or don't call someone back, like this person. I just remembered I didn't call back yesterday, but do you know what? It's actually not a problem because I'll call her back as soon as I finish here and she'll be fine with it because she knows I've got you know stuff on with kids or whatever. Listen to the podcast for the evidence that you acknowledged it.
Speaker 1:Listen to the podcast for the evidence that you acknowledged it. That's right, that's right. So it gives you a little bit more leeway, so that's why I always encourage it and yeah, and there's that quote that they say your clients will become friends quicker than your friends become clients as well, so I think that that happens.
Speaker 1:Yeah, a hundred percent. Okay, we've got three minutes. One more, let's. Unless you had any good ones, I'm at your hand. Yeah, okay, all right, we'll get a few in. If you want it done. Right, do it yourself. I need to give you this advice.
Speaker 2:A little bit, sometimes no, and I'm really learning delegation and letting go and again, part of it is that relationship you have with your clients or how you advise things. Some people do just expect you to be the doer and shifting that mindset or building trust and understanding, like I've built the process and I've got the people that know my process. So essentially you're doing it without doing it and it's leveraging yourself. This has been a really big one for me to learn because I've always been that oh, just do it myself, just do it myself. And I know you were talking with Shannon this week about controlling and things like that and being a control freak.
Speaker 1:Are you being a control freak, nikki? No, no, do you know what I?
Speaker 2:think the complete opposite In the sense of like it's really different.
Speaker 2:I've got to say yeah, being a strata manager in my own business now and not having to like when shit does hit the fan and something goes really wrong and it happens, you know, with property insurance and things like that, I get to choose how it's responded to and I love that. Like that is. I think what I feel I've been lacking all these years as an employee, I guess, is that you've always had someone else to answer to or an instruction to take. Here. It's like I get to make that decision and roll with this and do it with kindness and compassion and everything we talked about. I've just hired a VA now. So I built out, like in the first couple of months, as I was onboarding and things, I've built out my processes and really, as I was onboarding and things, I've built out my processes and really solidly my way so I can looking at the way that I can leverage me as the strata manager but leverage the portfolio so it can be bigger, more efficient and process driven, giving me the time to spend with the people.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah.
Speaker 2:And, you know, bringing Shaiqa on my VA has been amazing and she's really adapting to it. Bringing Shaiqa on my VA has been amazing and she's really adapting to it. And I think the fact that I, you know, wrote a standard operating procedure for absolutely everything I did in that first three months really helped. Yeah, because even if it's just my draft-like process, this is what I would do, how I would do it. It's building out the knowledge base for Resistrata and how things will be done. So, yes, I've been really bad at being the control freak, but I'm learning.
Speaker 1:I think we've all been there. I think we've all given ourselves that anti-advice yeah, if you want it done right, do it yourself and it's. I think I had it probably for a good maybe good 17 years of my business, to be honest. But you get to a point where you go, you know what stuff it like and you have to let people learn and give people the opportunity. So you do get over it. But that's probably actually one of the really hard ones because no one it's like, even like people, will say no one's going to you know work as hard as you in your business or no one's going to treat them and you can't expect them to.
Speaker 2:And you can't expect them to. And that's the thing too. You've got to let go of the expectation Like I'm always big on. You know, a property manager, a strata manager, that I want in my business. I want someone with a business owner mindset. You know that business owner mindset that like drive and ambition and things like that. Yeah, but there still comes that level of like, hey, step back. If I'm not willing to get my hands dirty and do this, I can't expect someone else to either.
Speaker 1:Correct. Yeah, I'm really lucky, like my team, I would say, sometimes even take the business more serious than what Bill and I do. Like we've got like the opposite, but it's yeah, it's just, we've got like the opposite, but it's yeah, it's just, it's nice that they're like that, but we have, but it's also not expected. I guess maybe that's the difference. It's not expected of them, but they do treat it, yeah.
Speaker 2:But that's the culture you've built. You know what I mean. That's the way you've built the culture and I think that's really lovely, like I'm big on. Go have fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like and I think that's really lovely Like I'm big on go have fun, yeah. Like don't just sit here and do a job and perform tasks, Like I'm always always like the biggest thing for me is people before tasks, yeah. And if that means like go have a two-hour lunch break and enjoy yourself, or go catch up with a colleague or you know, go have coffee with a client, whatever, I don't expect you pushing paper and you know doing the daily grind the whole time you're in the office, or I don't even expect you to be in the office the whole time.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean it's like the more trust and freedom you give to your employees or your staff or the people in your business, the more they appreciate and respect where they are and they want to perform and do better too, because it's a two-way street. Yeah, but I'm so like. I'm so like, just have fun. I want to be having fun.
Speaker 2:I don't want to be here you know doing horrible things all the time. I want to enjoy. I want to be able to laugh and enjoy the people I'm with and, you know, eat good food and talk to different people and learn new things.
Speaker 1:And, I think, the more people that listen to his podcast and hear those stories. Because we had Lou on the podcast the other week and she was saying how she really felt like cake and one of her property managers was like, oh, I'm too busy. She's like no, we're off to go get cake. And she sort of grabbed her by the hand and made her go out to the bakery with her. Like that's sort of quite a common thing that we're seeing, you know, in office environments where, yeah, the business owner is, like you said, treating people as people first and employees second. So it's like working with your best friends every day. Let's quickly squeeze in one more. The customer is always right.
Speaker 2:Well.
Speaker 1:That's a very old school thing, isn't?
Speaker 2:it. That is yeah, I was going to say something I probably shouldn't have said, but I'm going to say it now because I was going to say that's a very boomer thing to hear.
Speaker 2:Sorry, my business partner is a boomer and I love him and it's great. But I've come to find and a good example of this is recently, like having your own business Sometimes the customer is not right and you do know better and the value you bring to the table is being able to provide them that service and let them know that diplomatically and in the right way. A good example of something so basic is right. We are completely electronic, so we will not offer or bend to give a paper invoice, regardless of how much you complain about that. And this is something that comes up a bit sometimes with the older demographic in our portfolio and you know we've come to talk a lot.
Speaker 2:I've spent a lot of time talking about why we will only email. You know our levy notices and this is an example of something where at first I was like, oh, I better just, you know, print it and send it for one. And it was actually Pete, my boomer business partner sorry to call you that, it was actually Pete that laid down the law for me and was like do not bend, this is our process and this is why we do it and understanding that, why? For myself, I was able to explain it In the sense. That's in the sense of something you know, where do you bend your process or your why to satisfy one customer that then turns into two and then creates inefficiencies.
Speaker 2:Or, you know, then there's the other end of the spectrum where you might have a customer wrong about a legislation thing. Or, you know, you've probably got prime examples between, like, a landlord and a tenant scenario and the landlord wants something and the tenant's probably well within their rights and the landlord's wrong and you've got to explain to them. Yeah, so, being tactful, and I always say you've got to bring them on the journey, you've got to like they're over here, you're over here and you need to bring them on the journey to understand the why. It's not about an attack, it's not about an authority or punitive approach. It's a valuable lesson, it's an understanding, it's a talking through. And again that comes with like where I say we're not just flicking emails back and forth, we're adding value. There's a bit of psychological, you know. We need to know how to talk to people, how to understand how different people communicate and bring them on the journey.
Speaker 1:I think, yeah, I've always been told to let them know they're wrong, respectfully. So there's, I mean, and there's loads of examples. We had one yesterday property manager was having troubles with and she, the owner, was wrong, but they are, at the end of the day, still the client. So this was to do with a bond deduction, some bond deductions. So I said to her listen, just go to the owner and make sure he can. He understands that you're hearing him. Just say that you can take any actions he wants.
Speaker 1:So if his instructions are that he wants that aircon panel that's broken fixed, I said that you will act on his instructions. Make sure he knows that he's got your support from that point of view. However, if it goes to court and the tenant applies to court because they don't agree with that deduction, as a property manager you don't feel that the owner will be successful in it. So that's your role is just to explain that you don't agree with that deduction. As a property manager, you don't feel that the owner will be successful in it. So that's your role is just to explain that you don't think they'll be successful, but you're still happy to take their instructions. So we're not there saying to the owner no, you're not going to get it.
Speaker 1:You know you're wrong, it's not going to work. It's fair wear and tear. It's letting them have that win, but letting them know what the consequences are. And I think as well, sometimes when the client thinks they're right and they're not believing what you say, it's just it actually comes down to trusting. They're just not trusting your opinion, so give them another opinion.
Speaker 1:So sometimes that might be screenshotting something from the DEMA's website. Maybe it's actually something in writing from a different authority. Sometimes it's just that they feel better calling REWA and getting advice from REWA. It's not actually. It's like give them another avenue to follow to find that correct answer, because you're giving them the correct answer. They don't want to believe you. And I say they don't want to believe you as it's not malicious. It's just they don't have that trust. So give them the second option so they can go hear it again, because there are people in the world that need to hear something seven times before they trust it as well. So help them on that journey find that answer themselves. So I feel like there's ways around it and you're still.
Speaker 2:it's not just you're wrong and I'm right, black and white and it's huge. In property management and strata management, think of like the old school way and like I was saying about authoritative and punitive, and it was always like this is what the legislation says, this is it. Well, I'm inclined to always say yes, but yeah, yes, but you know, rather than shifting or giving them a straight up no or making them feel like you're wrong. Yeah, it's always a yes, but Like yes, like the example you gave. Yes, we can go down that path, but please consider these things.
Speaker 1:Yes, that's right, so it makes them feel better about it. And yeah, now, I mean, I reckon we could have done a whole another half an hour on this, which we won't. But what I would love is, if you're listening to this podcast and you have any other anti-advice that you've been given that you want us to talk about and squash, it can come through anonymously. I say we do another podcast session on this and maybe keep on rolling with A bit of an anti-advice series.
Speaker 2:Correct, that's what I'm thinking.
Speaker 1:I'm thinking that so if you're listening and you've got some, shoot it through, dm me and I will book in another time with Nikki and we'll do another session on it, because it's fun to talk about that, because it's just going against that societal opinion. So we sometimes see things and we think, oh, am I meant to believe that? You know, I think it's nice to talk about it. But people feel normal, because we all have these thoughts. We don't necessarily just talk about them in public.
Speaker 2:Yeah, 100%, and we came in with all these crazy stories before. We didn't even get through them all We've got so many We've got to come back and do the AML session. Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:All the juicy stories about you know, yeah, the detectives that have called me the police there's a whole maybe it could be like a crime series. Yeah crime series, secret crime series on property management and real estate. I like that. We'll do that. So thank you for listening. Thank you, nikki, for your time, and make sure that you do send through a comment, so with your thoughts and comments, so that we can address them in the next one. Thank you for having me, ash.
