PM Collective - The ART of property management

Balancing client needs and budget constraints in property management

• Ashleigh Goodchild

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  • Overview of the Business Development Manager (BDM) role in property management.
  • Samantha Priddis' journey from sales to becoming a BDM.
  • Importance of the handover process between BDMs and property managers.
  • Tailoring the handover process to meet client needs and expectations.
  • Matching personalities between property owners and property managers.
  • Challenges in communication styles between BDMs and property managers.
  • Managing renovation projects, including minor vs. significant renovations.
  • Budget management strategies for renovation projects.
  • Importance of understanding client preferences and expectations during renovations.


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Speaker 1:

so today we have samantha pritis in the office to talk about the bdm process and particularly the renovation process. Um now, sam, have you done a podcast before?

Speaker 2:

I think we did one early on, when I very first started. Do you remember what we did the topic on? I think it was a handover process, like going from myself to the property manager. I think that's what we spoke about, but it was geez a while ago now.

Speaker 1:

It was a while ago, excellent, okay. So for those that don't know, sam works at SoCo as an amazing BDM. I would say that you and I'm saying it for you because you're not going to say this I would say that you're probably one of the highest performing BDMs that I'm aware of in WA. You do an amazing job. Do you want to give a little bit of a brief you know background for everyone to know a little bit more about you, about your history, et cetera?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely so. I don't even actually know if you know this, ash, but I kind of fell into real estate. So, like any good story, it involves a messy breakup at the time. You know like it does.

Speaker 2:

And my mum was working for a woman that was a sales agent and she was just cleaning her house and stuff like that and she was like, look, working with this sales rep, he's full on, he's intense, he's a high achiever, he needs an assistant. Mum was like I think Samantha could do that. So I met with him, did my licence and that's how I sort of got started in the industry, straight onto the sales side, lots and lots of weekend work, and absolutely loved it and just sort of progressed from there. I've done every aspect of real estate property management, sales, admin, reception, all of the above and finally landing a gig as BDM with you, which has just been amazing. This is the right role for me. It's got the good combination of the selling side of it and obviously all the legislation with property management and stuff like that. So I've been in the industry now for geez, coming up 12 years.

Speaker 2:

So it's been a long ride and yeah, that's how it sort of started. Long ride and yeah, that's how it sort of started, wasn't doing anything like this prior.

Speaker 1:

But, yeah, this is definitely where I where I fit. And it's funny, I didn't know all that. And the reason why I didn't know all that is because I don't really read resumes. I don't think I actually gave you one. No, you might not have, I don't even know how it all happened, but I definitely employ people based on you know, conversations and interactions and always, have always, done you know, going with gut. So I didn't know that and great, I'm glad. I'm glad that you had that history.

Speaker 1:

Now we're going to talk a little bit more, as a refresher, about the handover process, but I also want to talk a little bit about the renovation work that you are doing, because it's a big part of your job at the moment and I think it can be a bit of a sensitive issue as well. So we're going to talk today about renovations in properties, and when I talk about renovations, meaning significant stuff, you know where your boundaries, might you know, be when it comes to the work. At what point do you pay one contractor to do the whole job, as opposed to trying to save the owner money on separate contractors, just things like that. So before we get to that process, we just want to talk a little bit about process. We just want to talk a little bit about the handover and just how you manage new business when a owner says yep, I want to go with you, okay.

Speaker 2:

So my response to this question when we did our first podcast is probably going to be different to now, ash, because what I've learnt being so pissy is that I am actually really client focused. So depending on those clients' needs will depend what my handover to the property manager looks like. But if I was to generalise it, firstly, what I do is break it down into steps for the landlord so that they're aware at what point I will stay with them and at what point I will then pass them on to the property manager. So obviously all of the documentation prep is a given. So the management authority making sure that they understand all of those points in there and that sort of jazz, Obviously conducting an inspection of the house, making sure everything's okay there, doing a bit of a video flagging any potential maintenance or issues that I might see, and from there it's basically waiting till the property is ready.

Speaker 2:

So if that's a settlement or if it's a file pickup, and then moving forward from there, the whole way through that process, I'm mentioning little things to the property manager, so she's aware she's got something coming up, and I'm speaking with the owner mentioning the property manager's name, so they're familiar with each other already, and by the time I get to the point where I'm officially handing it over, I like to do a big welcome email to the or final sort of email to the landlord, copy in the property manager, and then I just go over all of the notes. Might need a new air con. This needs doing. This is, you know, blah, blah, blah. Whatever the situation might be, so that the property manager's got everything in writing, nothing's been missed, the landlord knows it all and hopefully from there it just provides a nice smooth transition for the two of them. That's it generally. But I do have some property managers that are control freaks and like to come in really early on in the piece.

Speaker 1:

No, names mentioned, but I know who they are.

Speaker 2:

So for those clients, it's a different process for them. So yeah, it really does. It just depends on where this property is going to end up and what property manager as to how that handover sort of looks. But paperwork, marketing communication noting any maintenance or potential issues, making sure all that's documented and all of that communication is passed on to the property manager, is basically it in a nutshell.

Speaker 1:

So what I like about what you said and something that we probably don't talk about is that it sounds like you have a process that suits the property manager at the receiving end, as opposed to you saying this is our process, this is how we do it, and a property manager has to suck it up. I like that there is some allowance for what the property manager prefers.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, well, you know, at the end of the day I've got to work with these property managers every day, but you know they're busy and they're time poor and they have the way that they deal with stuff, you know. And if this landlord is going to end up with this property manager, it's best that that property you know that landlord knows exactly what that PM is like from the get-go. And I also like to just constantly remind the client that I'm not the PM, because quite often you know you hear where people go oh, I thought you were going to be the property manager. It's like, well, no, this is my role and this is where we'll separate sort of thing. So I think you know, constantly mentioning the property manager and how they like to do things just makes that process a little bit easier. And they've got some PMs that just don't care and just wait till I dump it in their lap and they hit the ground running with it and they're fine with the email. So yeah, yeah, excellent.

Speaker 1:

We do work quite geographically based, but how important is matching personalities between owners and property managers. Does that come in?

Speaker 2:

It does, and if it's a situation where the property is going to end up with this person regardless, it's really a matter of educating them both and trying to buffer the situation to make sure that they gel. Do you know what I mean? So whether that's managing expectations for the property manager as to how much money this client's got to spend on the house.

Speaker 1:

Which is generally $500, not $5,000.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, or whether it's, you know, trying to educate the owner about the minimum requirements with the property and you know all of that sort of stuff. If I know how someone's going to react, then I'll try and sort of like filter that before it gets to the PM and full disclosure. You know, like I am very direct with the landlords and so are the property managers, and the property managers and I have very frank and open conversations, so there's nothing that's not unsaid between us and make sure that we're on the same page. It's just a matter of how we get there so that the client, you know, has the best experience going from me to them and hasn't got any issues and is confident once their property is with the PM.

Speaker 1:

So one of the big problems I see I think that we do it very well, but I do see this in other offices is where you've got a BDM who I refer to be like a puppy dog and the new client rings up and the BDM is all over them making sure like their calls are responded within like two minutes and really meeting the demands of this client. And then what happens is it goes to the property manager where you don't get that same interaction because it's not necessary number one. But it can definitely be a divide between BDMs and them maybe sugarcoating stuff to get the business, because at the end of day that's your job, to get the business, but then it completely falling short with the property managers. So you, I know, are very honest with clients, but how do you manage sort of those expectations, like with what you've told the owner to do and the property?

Speaker 2:

manager? Yeah, good question. So with me I always mention to the landlords. Obviously if the property is coming over vacant, there's a lot of communication between the PM and the landlord at that stage. But if this is a property that's coming over with a tenant already in it, there's not a lot for that property manager to really do. A tenant already in it there's not a lot for that property manager to really do. So what I do in those cases is really outline to the landlord that the ideal situation when you've got a property manager, an investment property, is that you don't hear from your property manager. So if you're not hearing from us, that's great.

Speaker 2:

She's still doing all of that work in the background. She's making sure you know the rent's paid and the property's maintained and all that sort of jazz. But it is literally that's what you want. So it's really trying to set that level of expectation from the get-go.

Speaker 2:

And you know we're going to do this, we're going to do this, we're going to get a great tenant in, we're going to do the first week inspection, you're going to get sent all of the reports, everything's going to be great, and then you're probably not going to hear from us, you're just going to see the money in your account and your statements at the end of each month and they're like great, that's what I want. So you know, I do try and make that really clear because one of the biggest complaints from landlords when we do pick up clients from other agencies is there hasn't been any communication. But that's generally surrounding issues. But I do like to get that cleared up right at the get-go so that everything's ticking along nicely. You know she's not going to call just to say hi if she's got, you know, no time.

Speaker 1:

So yeah, Okay, I'm going to throw you under the bus with a bit of a tricky question question, but it's, I think it's. It comes up and I think this people will resonate with this question. You bring on a new management and you think you know what? It's absolutely fine as is. Can we rent it out? It's not perfect, it's not like renovated, but it's perfectly fine. Passed on to the property manager and a property manager goes why are the floors not getting replaced? Why is the painting not getting done? How, like I don't know, even if it comes up a lot, but what? How would you balance that situation where the property manager thinks this property needs to be renovated and has such a high expectation of it where a BDM's gone, the property's absolutely fine, it doesn't need to be done.

Speaker 2:

So the issue. That only becomes an issue if the communication between the BDM, the landlord and the property manager hasn't been there in the get-go, Because at the end of the day, it doesn't matter. You know how much this client has just purchased his property for, or whatever. As a BDM, one of the first questions you should be asking your clients is tell me what your framework is. What's your goal with this property? What are we doing with it? Is this a set and forget? Is this something you want to leave to your children? Is this something you're planning to develop?

Speaker 2:

So all of those questions should be answered, first and foremost, so you know what they're doing with this property, what their goals are, and then from there you'll work out okay, well, we're only going to do essential repairs, because in two years' time we're going to knock it down. Or we actually want to renovate this whole property, but we want to do it over a five-year period and we want to manage tenancies in between. So all of that information you should have and you should be able to pass that on to the property manager so that those sorts of things don't come up, I think is probably the best response to that.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Let's get into renovations, because I know that you are very busy doing renovations at the moment. I mean, there's different types of renovating. Doing a new paint and a re-carpet is one thing, and when I'm talking about renovations, I'm referring to some significant work, like what's been sort of the biggest one that you've done lately in terms of dollar value.

Speaker 2:

So the highest dollar value one was 50k and that was because there was air cons, roller doors and a bucket load of stuff, the one that I'm currently working on. At the moment we have a very tight budget of 20, with five in the background as for just in case. So that has been very challenging. The only bonus to this particular renovation job is most of the kitchen is done, but it's bathroom, laundries, flooring, paint, you know, retic and landscape and lighting and all of that. So that's been quite challenging. But you know there's a big difference between a renovation and a facelift and I don't know if all of the property managers will agree with what I'm going to say, but in my head I think the top five a property manager should absolutely be capable of doing within her portfolio so paint, flooring, blinds, clean, garden, tidier. I just think that that is easy enough to coordinate and that should fall comfortably within a property manager's role and you should have those trades already on your books to easily know who to arrange.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, but when you've got a client that decides they want to convert the laundry into that second bathroom, something like that I feel shouldn't fall onto the property manager, because there's a lot of work involved with that, especially if you are working in tight budgets and you want to try and get as much work done for the landlord for the best possible price and work within all the timelines and all of that sort of jazz. So I think at that point it's good for the property managers to be able to have someone where they can go. Okay, well, you know, if you deal with Samantha for now, once that's all up and running, then she'll give you back to us or whatever the situation may be, because I don't think that is fair for a PM.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely, it's been so busy.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I mean, and just to disclose, so we've got Sam set up as a, where she's got a separate entity so that she can handle these things as well. So having someone that you can use to actually have that as part of their job role and as a separate sort of side thing as well to action, that I think is really helpful. Because, I agree, I think there has to be a limit. My concerns are there has to be a limit of dollar value. I think the minute that you maybe need to get the council involved, a builder involved, for me, like, I think, as a property manager, that's overstepping what our experience really is. So I do agree with that.

Speaker 1:

But the other thing is is that at what point and I don't know if you've got any boundaries around this, but at what point would you say, and I don't know if you've got any boundaries around this but at what point would you say, okay, we're going to give this job to, you know, abc Maintenance Works, who can do all the works, and they're just going to give us one bill and then it's all done, and that bill might be $50,000. Or if you were to get your separate plumber, electrician, tiler, you know vanity, maid, et cetera. You could definitely save the client money by doing that, but is that our role, your role? You know, is there a boundary?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, no, there's no boundary.

Speaker 1:

Nice answer. I like that Short answer to that, ash.

Speaker 2:

So look, if a property manager was doing it, I would say absolutely yes, and they should be able to go to that one-stop shop and go quote. There's the price. Get it done For me, because I do do it separately, you know, and I've always been client focused. It's what they want, so I can get the quote from ABC Maintenance, who's going to list everything, can have it as one big, you know, beautiful, shiny price and make my job bucket load easier.

Speaker 2:

But at the end of the day, the clients want a couple of different quotes, they want a couple of options. They need me to be flexible, I need them to be flexible. We need to prepare for variables and stuff like that. And at the end of the day, it's their house, it's their money and it's their decision and all I'm there to do is help, guide them through the process and offer. You know, obviously, my thoughts and opinions on what they can and or what they could and could not do, but at the end of the day, it's up to them. And if they want two quotes from two separate titles, then that's what they want. So I'll just get it done. Yeah, I think that's, but sometimes I feel like I probably shouldn't eat boundaries, but We'll work them out later.

Speaker 1:

I think that's really. It's a good reminder, and I think a lot of people forget that it is the owner's property. They get to make the decision and their budget, and the best you can do is you know is is give them what they're requesting and leave it with them, and then you, as a property manager, a BDM or business owner, have the choice as to, yes, we want them as a client or no, we don't. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

And most of the time, as soon as you give the clients the choice, they'll, you know they do say well, what do you think in your experience, what have you seen? Or you know, and I'll go well, this, this and this, and they'll go great, let's go with that. Do you know what I mean? So it's not like they're just going to not listen to me and paint the walls pink or not put any retic in on a massive 800 square metre section of lawn or whatever it may be. So they do take on board everything that we say and because I've got so much experience and I've got case studies and I can show them what I've done in the past, they feel really confident and they feel very comfortable and open and honest with where they want to be and what they want to do and what they like, and it sort of just works itself out.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I was going to get to that. Because you do such a high volume, you generally roughly know how much it's going to cost to paint a house and do flooring, and so you're already having those discussions before the quotes probably already come in.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So budget's a really tough topic to have with a client and it's probably at this point that I like to do a Zoom meeting, if I haven't already done one, because I find that when you start to talk serious numbers, it's better to do it face-to-face, and I feel like you kind of get invited into someone's home when you do a Zoom meeting. So I'm very, very upfront with them and just go what are we working with? Just tell me how much you've absolutely got, so that I can get all of the quotes for you, and then we can work out what we can actually fit in within your budget. And, of course, I'll offer up. You know, I've recently painted a house that cost me five and a half or whatever it may be, so they've got some guidance there. But yeah, budget's a tough one.

Speaker 1:

I think if you know how much budget the client's got, it is easy. Like I love nothing more than a client saying my budget's $5,000, what's the best way to spend that much money? And then you have control as to what they spend, Because there's no point a client going and spending $5,000 on something that you don't think is going to give any value. That's right.

Speaker 2:

You'd rather have?

Speaker 1:

control of that. And one thing that I've sort of learned over time is there's little things, that little tricks, that you can do. For example, if the client has a really tight budget but the property needs painting, sometimes I would consider just getting the walls done and not the ceilings, or just getting the doors and door frames done and saving some money in that. Just because the house needs painting, you could potentially go from a $9,000 paint job down to a $5,000 paint job just by getting the walls done.

Speaker 2:

Absolutely, yeah, yeah, that's absolutely something that we do and if they are in a very tight budget, we can focus on the things that need to be done to get that tenant in place and then we can have that list of things that we want to get done during the tenancy. That's not going to interfere with the tenant too much, but it's also going to improve the property. So, whether that's upgrading the air cons or installing the dishwasher or whatever, so yeah, definitely can save money that way and get that income coming in with putting a tenant in.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and that's actually a good, quick little topic to talk about, because we did have a client where this property needed so much done to it and we were focused on just what has to be done to get advertising photos done and get this property leased out like we'll get this property rented and advertised and marketed, which was like our main point. And there were I think it was just the paint, that was mainly what needed to be done and something outside, for example. But then the owner was very clear with what the other items they still need doing. We're not saying they don't need doing, but at least we can get photos done, get it advertised and then we can deal with it. And that actually turned around. I don't know whether you heard the story. It turned around where the owners now said get everything done. And so now we're like, great, we'll get it all sorted. I think maybe someone spoke to him about it and said just get it done.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, well, not just that. You've got to remember, you know, when a property's vacant and an owner's spending money on it, that's what's keeping them up at night. So if we can reduce that period and reduce that cost as much as we can, so at least they're not worrying so much about the property being vacant and you know all the issues that are associated with that but also that we've managed to keep the cost down and they've got that sense of okay, all right, all right. Now I can focus and really go forward with what I want to do. But do you find, ash, that in those cases it's also being able to manage the owner's expectations, because you know in their head they're going oh, but at the end result the property is going to look like this we're just going to do this little bit, but I want the rent, you know. So that's a conversation to have with them. Go well, we're not going to be able to achieve that rent just now. Yeah, managing that we had.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, we had that where. Um, we just had to explain that the purpose of doing all the work was to get that better tenant and so if you're not going to do all the work right now and you're going to do it later, just, we still got that concern and we were just honest. Like we just said listen, that is still our concern that if we don't get it done before advertising that tenants are going to just go, yep, nah. So fortunately, it's come around. It was a risk, though, that we were going to take, because it was such a sensitive issue with getting the works done. It was like okay, if this is the best we can do is just get that paint done, get it marketed, then we'll work with that and still attend the other stuff.

Speaker 1:

But yeah, it's, it comes down to it is the owner's own property. That's right. Yeah, they make the decisions and I think owners are loving the investment journey they want to have, they want to make the decisions, and I think owners are loving the investment journey they want to have, they want to make those decisions. They actually want to be part of renovations and things like that as well.

Speaker 2:

I'm sure you find that. Yeah, absolutely, Yep, Yep for sure. And I just keep them constantly updated with videos and photos and all of that, so they feel like they're not being forgotten about and I'm just not over here doing everything, and then I'm going to go okay, we're done. And they're going to be like oh well, when did that all happen?

Speaker 1:

So yeah, constantly updating them? Yeah, excellent. Final question, and do you find you have a problem or issue with landlords always coming back to you, even though it's all been passed on to a property manager, or are they pretty good these days?

Speaker 2:

Look, I think I always sort of say to the landlords if you can't get a hold of your property manager and you've got a burning question, you can always flick me an email or give me a call and I'll help out where I can. So they do know that they can call me. But you know I try and stay in my own lane as much as possible. So if I get a call from a landlord I'm generally going to call the property manager first and just go. Such and such is called. You know, is there any issues that I need to be aware of? And they'll go. You know, no, or whatever the situation may be, and then I'll call the owner back. I don't have a problem with speaking to owners. Hopefully they're calling me because they've got another property. That's hopefully why they're calling me. But yeah, so I don't think it's an issue. I don't think the PM's mine and it doesn't happen that often at all. Yeah, just every now and then.

Speaker 1:

I wanted to see what you said, because that's good that it doesn't happen that often, because it does mean that that handover process has worked, the property manager is, you know doing, is meeting up to their expectations and they don't feel the need to have to call you. So I guess, just finishing off this episode, it would be, if you are a BDM and you are finding that you are constantly getting you know the clients that keep on coming back to you and not the property manager and it's really hard to sort of sever that relationship that it would most likely be that the BDM needs to have a better system with handover.

Speaker 2:

I think in the past six months I've probably had two owner calls, and they were one was asking about a renovation estimate cost for a patio and one was I can't even remember, I think it might have been a pocket dial.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, do you know what I?

Speaker 2:

mean Like it's absolutely nothing serious, which is good yeah amazing, Fantastic.

Speaker 1:

Well, thank you for coming in sharing that, no problem. We do learn a lot about finding out how other people do things in their office, so it's really lovely to share that. And if you are a BDM and want to share how you do things in the office as well, feel free to reach out and we'll get you on as an episode. I'm always looking for guests, so please reach out if you do. But thank you, Sam, for your time. It's great finding out a little bit more and sort of see me doing, you know, a little one-on-one, you know meeting.

Speaker 2:

We can tick that box too. We've done.