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Expert Tips to Combat Burnout in Property Management

• Ashleigh Goodchild

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Ever wondered how to effectively manage burnout in property management? Join this group podcast featuring insights from industry experts like Bec Halton, Simone from One Agency, Shelby from Rose Petal Properties, Skye from Taylored Property Management, and Kelly Seaton from the Leasing Network. Discover the root causes behind the escalating burnout rates in the property management industry in Australia, from surging client expectations to the lack of technological support. Skye shares her firsthand experience with burnout and the critical importance of taking annual leave, while Simone offers practical solutions like employing external third parties to manage workloads during staff leave. 

This episode goes beyond identifying the problem to provide actionable strategies to combat burnout and foster a supportive work environment. We highlight the importance of a balanced approach to control and delegation, the significance of clear role definitions, and the benefits of teamwork in both large and small agencies. Through personal stories and expert advice, this episode is a comprehensive guide for property managers aiming to sustain their well-being and thrive in their professional lives. 

Lots of tips from a wide range of business owners on how they are managing it in their office. 

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Speaker 1:

Today we have a group podcast, which basically just means that I've got together five other property management experts in Australia to join me for this recording so that we can get a little bit of extra info from a few perspectives, and so I'm really excited to have five fantastic options to talk about burnout today. So we're just going to quickly get everyone to intro themselves so that you know who you're listening to. So we'll go, we'll start with Bec and then we'll just everyone take a turn and then we'll get stuck into it.

Speaker 2:

Thanks, Ash. I'm Bec Holton from LJ Hookah City Residential here in Perth. We look after two and a half thousand properties and I've got about 47 staff under it.

Speaker 1:

Amazing Simone.

Speaker 3:

Hi, thanks, ashley. I'm Simone from One Agency, orange. I manage a team of three and been in the industry for just over 17 years now.

Speaker 1:

Amazing Shelby. Hi guys, I'm Shelby from Rose Petal Properties, branched out on my own, so it is only me and yeah, so new to this business ownership.

Speaker 4:

Fabulous Welcome and Sky um and yeah, so new to this business ownership. Fabulous welcome and sky hi everyone. I'm sky. I operate taylor property management in south australia. I am in my 20th year of real estate. I'm currently just a sole operator, but have managed teams of property managers in the past fabulous, andulous and the lovely Kelly.

Speaker 5:

So I'm Kelly Seaton from the Leasing Network. We're on the New South Wales Central Coast and we have a small team of three at the moment. We have had a larger team over the years but yeah, we're just having a small boutique team here and been in the industry for around 27 or 30 years or something crazy.

Speaker 1:

Fabulous. And then then I am Ash good child, and so I look after SoCo Realty and we've got, I think, about 15 staff, but three of them are in sales, so the rest are property management. So the topic for today was burnout, and I actually don't really even like the word burnout because it's quite like it's a bit cliche, it's getting overused and um but I don't know sort of the other word to um to use to describe what is sort of happening in the industry with people coming out. So we'll just sort of open it up to you all and obviously anyone can just jump in. But I guess what I would be interested to sort of hear is people's perceptions on what they think is causing burnout in the industry. So who would like to jump in first?

Speaker 2:

I'm happy to Ash if you want. We've had some really aggressive growth and I think you know we've witnessed some burnout internally, which has been, you know, we've witnessed some burnout internally, which has been, you know, quite a. It's been a good experience for us to go through. But I think there's a couple of things. I think the expectation of the client has really ramped up, in terms of both the tenant and the landlord, and I'm also finding a lot of businesses. So we've had a couple of property managers come to us and want to work here because where they are working, the business owner doesn't understand property management, doesn't want to invest in property managers and also probably doesn't have the technology and the support that the property managers need to do a really good job, need to do a really good job. I think you know, I think all three of those like technology, support and then some leadership, all three of those things if it's lacking in any of those, would cause people to burn out really quickly because they've just got too many balls in the air.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think one of the issues I talk about is sales led directors and how they can actually be-.

Speaker 2:

I'm a sales-led director though.

Speaker 1:

You're a little bit different.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, they do. They don't really understand the pressures that come with PM. You're right.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, absolutely. What about you, Skye? I mean, you've got to manage your own burnout. But when you look at the industry and what you're seeing, what do you think is contributing? And you actually probably had burnout when you did your first round of real estate, didn't you?

Speaker 4:

I did so when I had my business 12 years ago.

Speaker 4:

I literally burnt out, exited out of the business because there was no one in my corner going, hey, why don't you just have a holiday instead of exiting out.

Speaker 4:

So that was a very big learning lesson. But certainly when I was managing a team of property managers, the biggest frustration for them and perhaps it speaks to what Bec said is the lack of the tech, the lack of the leadership, but in the ability to take annual leave and actually recover from what is a very demanding role. So we were constantly looking at systems and how we could improve and actually support the property managers to take leave, because no one wants to take leave when you're coming back to a nightmare of problems and things not being dealt with. So we actually implemented a buddy system, so two property managers would be paired up. If one went on leave, the other one would then step in and vice versa. So it kept them accountable because they knew if they then took leave and they didn't do the job properly, then it was going to be returned to them. So that was really a big difference, because I hear a lot of colleagues who are just tired from running constantly and they just can't get their annual leave or a break to recover.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, Simone. Do you have a system with your team Like what happens in your team when people are on leave?

Speaker 3:

So we do make sure that, trying to make everything covered, or we've also used like an external third party to help assist and have someone come on part-time while someone's on leave, because, yeah, there's nothing worse than, you know, going on, leave and coming back and your inboxes fall with hundreds of emails and things that you know shouldn't turn into a big bushfire do if they haven't been dealt with. Um, I find it very hard to do that, especially being, you know, head of the department and business owner. I find it very hard to to switch off. I always keep my finger on the bike, even if I'm not in the office, because I just think, as a business owner, that I have that role and responsibility. I don't feel that I should put that burden on my staff.

Speaker 3:

But, yeah, it's definitely something that we all experience and I think when you reach a certain level in the industry, you have those expectations on yourself, and managing someone's property is a huge responsibility that you know I take on quite personally, and I guess a lot of us that are, you know, at the top do as well. So it's it's a it's a tricky getting that work-life balance. I think that that's a big cause for burnout because you're just on the go 24 7 and you know high workloads. Like you said, conflict management, it seems to be people are going from zero to 100 a lot faster. Um, and yeah, expectations have gone have really lifted a lot, um, since I've started in property management, that's for sure yeah, shelby, what's your experience?

Speaker 1:

so you're out on your own now. Um, so previously, I guess, being an employee, was this a problem for you. So, and something that I used to implement in teams was mental health days. So if I could see, um, you know, with body language, attitude, workload, work performance, if I could see, you know, with body language, attitude, workload, work performance, if I could see that someone was getting weighed down and struggling, I'd pull them inside and go, okay, let's plan a mental health day Day you're going to take off next week where you don't you leave your company phone at work, you don't check your emails, you just have a day for you One.

Speaker 1:

It kind of built the respect and the I guess, the team culture. It really helped with that because then they could see that I understood where they were at in their work week and that I was kind of being like take the time, don't get burnout. So I was trying to do the preventative burnout and my team loved it, because it's really hard. You know in yourself when you can feel that you're getting to that stage of burnout but you're like I just have to keep going, I can't admit it, I have to just keep going. And a lot of employees that are still in the industry and they're still passionate about it. They will not admit that they're getting tired and they're getting burnt out. So being able to see the body language and implement something before it gets to that stage, I think that was something that really worked well.

Speaker 1:

But yeah, I totally agree with what everyone said. We also did the buddy system, similar to what Sky's done, and paired up, and it made a world of difference. Not having someone have the pressure of end-to-end. It was, yeah, a game changer. And what about you, kel, with your team? I think that you've probably got it pretty down pat, don't you, with making sure everyone has a break.

Speaker 5:

My team. Yes, I think it really does come down to like leading from the top, though, and setting those, you know, letting the team know that they can take time out. Or they do have the support, do you know what I mean? So having that support really matters. Or they do have the support. Do you know what I mean? So having that support really matters. I think when I can see that they have some sort of excessive workload, obviously your brain changes into that stress, tired, exhaustion mode. So, exactly as Shelby said, maybe that's the call out to have a day off or to be able to just give yourself some flexibility, because you're obviously going to get nowhere being in that state of mind. You know the ability to concentrate and be able to do your best is obviously not going to happen there. So, yeah, definitely they get lots of rewards and special treats.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I've just had a situation where one of my team members resigned. She was with us for six months and I don't get a lot of resignations, but the last two that I've had in two years. So both of them both of them after six months got out of the industry and the only factor that I can pinpoint is the fact that they worked from home. And what happened was they both insisted on working from home and I don't like it. But I had society telling me that you know, you need to allow work from home and this and that and get with the times. And I allowed it because, not because I wanted to, but because everyone's saying, well, that's the way the world's going. Ash, like, get on board.

Speaker 1:

And both times I've had people only last for six months, and so for me I feel like that burnout and that's actually them getting out of the industry um is because they didn't have that support internally and that good team um or, if you know, in sky's case, where she's, you know, know, a solopreneur having the network around you. So even if you are on your own, you can still create your own network. But for me that's what I found, that and now it means that if I do go and replace them down the track, I'm just going to be really against work from home, because for me that's just not working for me?

Speaker 1:

Do you guys have someone in your team that completely works from home, and how can you keep an eye on their burnout levels as well?

Speaker 2:

no, we don't have anyone who completely burns out uh, burns out from home, works from home, I think. Um I, I agree with you. I think hovid taught us that's not ideal full-time work from home. Um, I, I do. I do like the hybrid um situation and you know we've got really good feedback around that. Our girls can choose to work up to two days from home if they want and it just gives them a chance to get on top of stuff. You know, washing, cooking while they're working, so they do like their work from home. But I don't think full-time work from home is good for anybody and I'm finding more and more people want the hybrid, but definitely not full-time work from home. I haven't had anyone request that.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I'm going to put my foot down next time. I think yeah.

Speaker 2:

Look, even you know yourself, you just get in a rut if you're just working from home every day. Even as an introvert, you don't. You still need to. You know, get in amongst people at some point to get your mental health. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

Well, you are in property management, of course, so you've got to, you know, keep those skills up, those people's skills up yes exactly.

Speaker 1:

So ultimately, the let me just bring out my questions is I think one thing that's really important is being able to know that their work is going to be looked after by a colleague or a business owner. On the other end and I think that's probably where I have like a bit of a issue with those sales lead directors, because I'm not aware of any traditional not VEX, but traditional director led directors, so sales lead directors who would help take over a portfolio when that person's on leave. So I do quite a, we do have the buddy system, but then I help quite a bit when people are on leave. I'm actually just a very selfish question, curious as a business owner, do you guys ever jump in when someone's on leave or do you leave that just with your team?

Speaker 5:

um, let's go with kel to start off with that job needs to be handled every day of the week gives you that connection and just making sure that when that person does come back from leave, that they're not just having to go through the 200 emails and you know they're obviously not going to enjoy themselves while they're away. I think my team actually don't take leave intentionally because they're probably fearful of what's going to happen when they come back. Um, so it's definitely a jump in and do what you can roll while they're not here yeah.

Speaker 1:

And what about you, simone? How do you? What policy do you have like? Do you take it on board as a business owner or do you leave it with your account?

Speaker 3:

No, 100%. I jump in and take over. You know I've, you know, put that in place that if anyone is off or needing to be done, that if, if there's extra workload to take on, that falls onto my shoulders to make sure that everything's managed. But again, I'm a bit of a control freak. So I like to make sure that you know if someone is off, that they know it's taken care of and that they can come back and not have to stress or worry that something's been either left or missed or not handled. And you know I think that's really falls onto the responsibility because I am able to do that. Then you know I think that's really falls onto the responsibility because I am able to do that. Then you know, I see that as something that I can do and to help my staff know that I've got their back 100% with whatever they need. I think that's really important to try and build a good culture as well, to know that I'm willing to get in the trenches, do the hard yards and lead from the top.

Speaker 1:

I think that there is. This is good for people to listen to that are potentially running a business but not doing this support for their employees. So it hopefully is a bit of a reality check for them. So obviously we're talking about business owners who help and jump in for annual leave when they're a certain size. So you know, like with Simone, with your size, absolutely you would jump in With my size. I'm sort of at that point where I do rely on a lot of the team and their buddy system to support but I absolutely do a bit. But then Beck, with your size office, I guess that would come down to a department manager. Would it to jump in?

Speaker 2:

No, we don't have a head of department, that's me but I do have a full-time floater. She's a senior property manager and just covers all the leave. But I've also got a team of VAs who are basically trained up as property managers as well. So they'll take a brunt of the like, the VAs will take a brunt of it, and then the floater just jumps on and, you know, gets involved with the landlord side of things. Yeah, so we've got some pretty tight systems around that, but our team definitely know when they take a holiday, they take a holiday.

Speaker 2:

That is a big part of mental health. I also think just on that, ash, you know I feel like and I see this a lot with headed departments and you know property managers, this control, you know it's always been. It's always been like oh yeah, you're a control freak, you'll make a really good property manager or you need to stay. You know it's like you need to stay on top of everything. What I've found and we've really spoken about this a lot in our business is, you know, you can't attach your value to your busyness and I talk about this all the time because as soon as you start attaching your value in our business to how busy you are, you won't let go and delegate. The things that don't need to be like that need to be delegated.

Speaker 2:

So we're really big on the senior property manager's sole role is to build relationships with their landlords, create wealth and you know, and really be proactive property managers with their clients. And all the rest of it can be delegated and I feel like that's really allowed that mental load to soften when they're very, very clear on what their role is with the landlord and all the other stuff, all the balls in the air, the lease renewals and the MA renewals and the maintenance everything's taken care of either through software or virtual assistance and they're just managing that sitting on the top. So you know we've tried to get rid of. You know we're working towards doing 100% of the work in 80% of the time for 100% of the pay. That's our motto here. So we want you to get paid more, work less and be less stressed.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I'm glad you brought up the control, because that was my next question is are we too controlling? So I'll throw that one over to Shelby and also Sky. Do you guys think that we are, as property managers, too controlling and is that affecting us, potentially taking that leave? You want to go first Shelby? Yeah, 100% we are. But yeah, it's really hard to, I guess, separate the two, especially as business owners.

Speaker 1:

I know personally, when starting my business, I had a plan that I'm only going to cap the amount of properties I'm taking on. So right now I've only got a space for 40 new clients and although I'd love to grow and this means that I can't grow as quickly as I want it means that it's not going to compromise my wellbeing or my mental health and it's not going to compromise the service I'm providing, because, whilst I do have my mom in the backend doing all my accounts and admin, I'm still the face of the business. I'm still the one talking to the tenants and dealing with the owners. So it's really it's on me as to how much I do control. Where do I draw that line? And it was something that I had to set from day one is that I'm only doing this.

Speaker 1:

Many properties and I will not say yes to anyone Like your property has to kind of suit the demographic of what I'm taking on and where I'm trying to take my business. Otherwise I won't manage it, and I think that was really important for me from day one. And you're a bit like that too, skye, aren't you Quite selective with who you work with?

Speaker 4:

Yeah, and there's definitely a plan in place for the growth to manage, I guess, the capabilities and capacity to make sure that we don't reach a burnout point, because we are very controlling when we're business owners but wanting to strategize, okay, if we're at X number of properties, what support do we need in order to keep managing that successfully? And certainly when I was managing teams of property managers, the control sometimes was a bit of an indicator that the wheels might be falling off and so they're not wanting to take leave, they're not wanting to step away from it because they've got perhaps some spot fires here, there and everywhere and if they were to step away, that would then be discovered. So for those who are managing teams, that was certainly something that I noticed if people were reluctant to take leave or to step away from it.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I know that for me, what we're trying to work with with our office is something that I've noticed where in property management, you've always got a list of things to do and when you're finished with doing the urgent stuff, you just work on everything else and you continue to work, um and um. There's always something to do, basically. But what I'm trying to do is get to a point where you've got the team's got tasks and then when the tasks are done, you go and a little bit sort of like what Bec's sort of suggesting with that, you know, cutting down the workload to 80%. I'm sort of trying to do it so that when you've done tasks, your job's done, you go home, whether that's 12pm, 2pm, 3pm, whatever, but we don't carry those things so that we can align ourselves with businesses where. But we don't carry those things so that we can align ourselves with businesses where you know like a I don't know a, I don't know a checkout, checkout, chick, when you do your job, you go home and there's nothing else to be done till the next shift. So I guess that's sort of where I'm, my brain's always going and trying to achieve with our processes and systems. So we're not quite there, but it's definitely a goal.

Speaker 1:

So, to finish off, I think we've sort of really said that. You know, number one identifying burnout is something that we probably don't really identify very well. So getting better at that with our team business owners, making sure that they're the ones responsible for keeping an eye on this I know everyone's responsible for themselves, but business owners being responsible for keeping an eye on people that aren't taking leave or, if they're not taking leave, even encouraging those mental health days that Shelby mentioned, which I think is a really great idea and giving them confidence that they will be able to go and leave and everything be looked after. So really having a responsibility to make sure that when they return to work, that everything's like nice and easy for them to slip in. So let's just finish off with maybe an idea of something that you do in your business, whether it's for yourself or for your team, that is considered a bit of a mental health treat to help prevent burnout. So we'll finish up with those tips from everyone.

Speaker 2:

Let's go start with you, bec, and we'll go along um, I think we do a lot of personal development around um. You know just how to out. We don't do a lot of property management training anymore. My PMs have been with me for, I think, an average on 12 years, so they all know what they're doing. They're all really good at what they do. But we do do a lot of um. You know personal development around. You know we talk development around. You know we talk about I get finance specialists in, I get health specialists in, I get dietitians in.

Speaker 2:

So I am always trying to make their lives a lot better outside of the business, just so that. Yeah, I think that's just the balance we give. We also have a rule as a mum in this office, as a parent, we have a rule that you don't miss a sports carnival, so that whether you're getting a certificate at school, you know a dance recital, whatever it is. You don't miss it for work. It's just not that important. So I think that gives our team a bit of a balance that they like.

Speaker 1:

Amazing Simone.

Speaker 3:

So I think having regular check-ins with your team and doing team building activities are really important so that they feel comfortable. If there is something or if they're feeling a little bit overwhelmed or getting to that stage that they're able to actually communicate that with you, so that you can have that support and put things in place to, you know, be able to bring them back on track, rather than you know people not feeling comfortable to be able to talk to you and then they just, you know, put in their resignation or get out of the industry.

Speaker 1:

Amazing Shelby. I think mine will be a little bit on the flexibility side. So, yeah, checking in with your team, and I'm all for the like don't have strict hours, like you don't have to be in the office from 9 to 5. If you have something on in the morning personal appointment you do. You just get your work done and we're here for you in between. So I think the flexibility for me is a huge thing with the team Great Skye.

Speaker 4:

Well, I can't really speak to the team as such, but I make sure that I that I prioritize my health and wellness in order to balance the demands of running a business. Um, and I think everyone has a little mental health toolkit that they use, and that's something that I am more mindful of now, having been through burnout, and how to identify and stay on top of it before it gets to that point, and reaching out to the support network, you know, between social media, everyone around the country who's so willing to collaborate and help.

Speaker 1:

That's been really useful and what about you kel?

Speaker 5:

it comes down to wellness and well-being. For me, uh, and family is always first, so I think beck mentioned it earlier. If there's something on that they need to go to just go. That takes priority over your work. Your work can fit in. It's not a nine to five job, so if you do pop out for an appointment, you can obviously catch that up here or there if you're still needing to get through the day. But yeah, definitely to do with the mental, physical health and fitness side of things. We've even had some like a counsellor come in and we've had a group chat, just things like that, just to have that check in individually. So you know how they're doing in a personal sense as well as in a work sense.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, great. And for me I run the team where they get paid to do a job as opposed to certain hours, so for me that has really made a big difference with our team. So they know that they can attend to all those personal bits and pieces and that their pay is not associated with the hours actually that they do. So that's something that works.

Speaker 1:

I know it's not going to work for everyone, but it works really well for our office and allows them to deal with all their personal and family appointments and I'm a big believer that, if you can, if they're happy at home, they'll be happy at work. So definitely making sure that they are satisfying you know everything in their personal life, with relationships and children and their own health and things like that, because that has made a massive difference, um, with us. I had a funny story I actually brought up with one of my team yesterday, um, and when she was single and um, we're laughing about the day that I let her have a tinder day off and it was just she needed to go, she wanted to go on a date. She couldn't on the weekends because of the kids and she had asked if she could go on a date on a Wednesday. I was like, absolutely and I always laugh because it was actually worked so well, because I actually found she was so productive, because she was, you know, just satisfying her personal social life and things like that.

Speaker 1:

Within reason, I know, but it, um, it really made a big difference with culture and obviously it was only here and there. It wasn't even a big drama, but I just I think that there, um, there's lots of options and ways that you can be flexible. Um as a business owner and, hopefully, sort of the ideas that everyone here has shared. Um, you know it's a good reminder of, no matter the size, whether you've got a big agency like Beck, or if you're a sole preneur, or you know if you've just got a small team, there is something that you can do to adapt and help. So I hope that people listening can resonate with some of you guys and make sure that they're identifying that burnout in their office, because the last thing we want is people to leave because it is going to put more pressure on everybody as well.

Speaker 1:

So thank you guys for your time. Thank you for being the first people on a group podcast. It was I wasn't sure. I limited it to five people because I was like I'm not sure how this is gonna work with, like voices and names, and you guys were so good. There was like no overlapping of talking or anything like that. So thank you guys, did a great job thanks Ash, thanks Ash, bye, thank you.